Wild bees

Discussion in 'General Beekeeping' started by Stevo, Apr 21, 2017.

  1. Stevo

    Stevo Drone Beginner

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    wakiato
    Ratings:
    +0 / -0
    I found a colony of wild bees in a hole in a tree. Not far from mine. Way busier than mine to, typical. So i think its a good size, dont think its robbing, but there are some fighting and wasps, but not enough to alarm.
    Question is should i, and how can i treat them for varroa? Dont want them dying and i dont want mine robbing and bringing back varroa or AFB
    I was going to put a wet towel over most of the hole, about the size of a football and poke the OA vaporizer up there and hope. Cant get to the nest as its well up inside the tree.
    Any other ideas?
     
  2. john berry

    john berry Guard Bee Commercial

    Messages:
    1,340
    Location:
    Hawke's Bay
    Ratings:
    +3,288 / -0
    tip 1 L of petrol down the whole to give them a relatively quick death and then permanently block the hole with something like expanding foam or if you really don't want to do that place a one-way bee escape in their entrance and put a nuke outside together the bees. When you have got as many as you can then permanently block the hole. Option one is a lot quicker and easier. The easiest of course is just leave it to die but you do risk are varroa reinvasion in your hives and next year another swarm will move into the same hole.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Stirrer Stirrer x 1
  3. Rob Stockley

    Rob Stockley Hive Management Hobbyist

    Messages:
    5,064
    Location:
    Hastings
    Ratings:
    +5,842 / -1
    @Stevo if you maintain bees in a tree you will be in breach of the AFB Pest Management Plan. I wouldn't leave them if I couldn't get them into a standard format hive. Some bees are not worth pursuing.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Stevo

    Stevo Drone Beginner

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    wakiato
    Ratings:
    +0 / -0
    I never even considered that rob. I didnt want to catch them. But it seems a shame to kill them just because they are there and i found them.
    So the new plan would be try a bee escape thing into a box. Paper combine with mine, move the whole lot, treat for varroa again and seal the tree up
     
  5. Rob Stockley

    Rob Stockley Hive Management Hobbyist

    Messages:
    5,064
    Location:
    Hastings
    Ratings:
    +5,842 / -1
    You're unlikely to draw the queen away from the brood so you'll end up with a handful of bees in a box, no brood, no stores and no prospects of surviving winter. If this was spring then time might be on your side. But at this time of year they're a lost cause. How do I know? I tried and failed to lure a colony out of a tree. Eventually I poisoned them and sealed the tree as @john berry suggests.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Daley

    Daley Guard Bee Donor 2014 Platinum Donor '17 Commercial

    Messages:
    2,716
    Location:
    Gisborne
    Ratings:
    +3,596 / -0
    What if they have AFB? I sure wouldn't be combining them with one of my hives.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  7. thomas hancox

    thomas hancox Drone Beginner

    Messages:
    9
    Location:
    whangarei
    Ratings:
    +2 / -0
    i dont understand the mentality of so called protecters of new zealand honey bees.when there attitude is its not in a box so kill it.the truth is for every wild hive you kill is probablly 10 more there and they most likely are escapees of some beekeeper
     
  8. Bron

    Bron Guard Bee Commercial

    Messages:
    2,187
    Location:
    Gisborne
    Ratings:
    +2,904 / -0
    Good morning Thomas, welcome to the forum.

    I'll try and explain.

    I'm a commercial beekeeper. This is my living. I love our bees, I love my job. I make decisions about our bees every time, every moment of the day. when I enter an apiary and/or open a hive I look for disease, because I want healthy bees.

    Varroa can kill hives, I treat them so it doesn't. Any bees around my bees that aren't treated can affect my bees.
    AFB kills hives, when you get AFB you burn them. If bees around your hives have AFB they can affect your hives. You burn them.

    There are very few feral bees left in NZ because of the above. Most are uncontrolled swarms that sniff out old comb to move into, die because they are diseased and the cycle continues.

    Colonies in buildings, bridges, trees etc are difficult to rehome, sometimes heartbreaking, trust me I've tried. If they are unable to be rehomed into removeable frames they become a liability to the bee colonies around them as they can not be inspected for disease.

    In a perfect world you could save them all. Sometimes you can't.
     
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2017 at 09:23
    • Top Answer Top Answer x 5
  9. Trevor Gillbanks

    Trevor Gillbanks Field Bee Donor 2016 Semi Commercial Gold Donor '17

    Messages:
    7,318
    Location:
    Palmerston North, Manawatu
    Ratings:
    +7,628 / -5
    So what are you saying.
    Kill all feral bees.
    It does not matter if you kill feral bees,because there are so many feral colonies out there.
    or, Save every feral hive possible.
     
  10. Daley

    Daley Guard Bee Donor 2014 Platinum Donor '17 Commercial

    Messages:
    2,716
    Location:
    Gisborne
    Ratings:
    +3,596 / -0
    Keeping a beehive alive in a tree is illegal too, so if you know it's there and try to help it by giving it a varroa treatment then your breaking the law.

    Bees have to be on removable combs.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Rob Stockley

    Rob Stockley Hive Management Hobbyist

    Messages:
    5,064
    Location:
    Hastings
    Ratings:
    +5,842 / -1
    Killing a hive is a horrid experience. The noise. The devastation. The hopelessness. Certainly a last resort. If you're serious about the health of honey bees then it's an experience you must confront eventually.
     
  12. thomas hancox

    thomas hancox Drone Beginner

    Messages:
    9
    Location:
    whangarei
    Ratings:
    +2 / -0
    i was really pointing out the futility of killing them instead of trying to rehive etc.true or false ,if i own a beehive ,and bees travel 2to3 kilometers to harvest.and they mix with bees from a hive 5to6kilometers away(3+3)which has varroa etc.does this not mean that i need to know the condition of every bee colony within 6ks of where ever my bees are.an immpossible feat in most of nz i think???
     
  13. Daley

    Daley Guard Bee Donor 2014 Platinum Donor '17 Commercial

    Messages:
    2,716
    Location:
    Gisborne
    Ratings:
    +3,596 / -0
    Not really, you worry about that 2km forage area, and yes if there are bees closer than 2km to me I want to know about it, and I'll be asking those hives be moved because it's not in anyone best interests to be too close to others and to overstock areas.

    2km is not that big of an area, I use google maps and distance tool on my phone to work out how close I am to other hives, my hives are all at least 2km away from other beekeepers except one place where it's 1.5km and the other beekeeper is my friend and I asked him if it was ok.

    This should be the norm.
    Not sites on top on sites
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. Rob Stockley

    Rob Stockley Hive Management Hobbyist

    Messages:
    5,064
    Location:
    Hastings
    Ratings:
    +5,842 / -1
    True. You can only respond to the bees that you're aware of. But if everyone did that diligently there'd be far fewer hives being burnt.
     
  15. thomas hancox

    thomas hancox Drone Beginner

    Messages:
    9
    Location:
    whangarei
    Ratings:
    +2 / -0
    my point was unless you have checked every tree in that area how do you know how many wild hives there are.i live in town did a experiment on feeding bees ,had bees coming from 4 directions.lots of bees .but dont know of any hives in 2ks.lots of big old trees though
     
  16. Bron

    Bron Guard Bee Commercial

    Messages:
    2,187
    Location:
    Gisborne
    Ratings:
    +2,904 / -0
    Look up the statistics for hobby beekeepers in NZ. There are more hobby beekeepers than commercials. (Commercials have more hive thou.)

    There's a lot of hives in people's backyards that you'd never know were there. More the power to them as they are the responsible ones who keep bees for pleasure and don't cause problems for their neighbours.

    I have no hives at my home in Gisborne town, can't see any hives in my street or environment, but boy are they hoeing into my grapes now the birds have put holes in them! Grape nectar honey, bet that's yummy!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. thomas hancox

    thomas hancox Drone Beginner

    Messages:
    9
    Location:
    whangarei
    Ratings:
    +2 / -0
    same here fed them one sunny day in glass top hive,shut it about 3.0pm.would of had at least 2liters of bees.let them out on dusk they all flew home.one hive must be large as will hve 10or 12bees in flight at alltime are close approx 3min turn around.my yard was full of bees some days nice peaceful ones even my 2yr old daughter can put out her hand and hve them land on her
     
  18. ChrisM

    ChrisM Guard Bee Donor 2016 Silver Donor '17 Beginner

    Messages:
    1,094
    Location:
    tauranga
    Ratings:
    +1,050 / -0
    As well as the kill and bee escape options (trap out) there is at least one more option that is the "forced abscond". Lots of you tube clips on that predominantly done with trees as the op describes. I have only attempted it once and I did obtain a solid box of bees, however I didn't manage to get the queen as the blokes on you tube did. My colony was slightly below ground level and I used a combination of smoke and garden hose. I think if the colony is above knee height that and below 5m then the forced abscond is most feasible. If the tree is more than a metre in diameter with the bees at the core it also starts to become too hard. It is about four hours of work and the tree is sealed after. Done correctly, they do get the queen out. But at this time of year I would say it is too hard, and just delay until October. Depending on your hourly rate it is an expensive way to buy bees. Or cheap; as the case may be.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Daley

    Daley Guard Bee Donor 2014 Platinum Donor '17 Commercial

    Messages:
    2,716
    Location:
    Gisborne
    Ratings:
    +3,596 / -0
    I've done cutouts before, I used to try to save every beehive, but at this time of year the hive has a very minimal chance of survival.

    It's unlikely to survive the winter without intervention and varroa treatment and will die and be robbed out by neighbouring hives.

    So you can either get it out and it will take you hours and it will most likely die, or kill it because it poses a threat and it's probably not going to make it anyway.

    I'm not trying to put you off cutting it out, by all means if your keen have a go.
    But I wouldn't have any expectations of survival for your efforts.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  20. Stevo

    Stevo Drone Beginner

    Messages:
    4
    Location:
    wakiato
    Ratings:
    +0 / -0
    Well thanks for all the opinions, i sort of knew it was a risk which was why i asked the question.
    With all this legal talk i should add the tree is not on my land, so i guess the permission of the land owner is required before i can do anything. Not sure how he will react to me wanting to put a tube of builders foam in his tree, but will try to explain it along the lines of theileria in cows.
    Your neighbor might have it, he might not, but you dont want it do you. You cant test them all for it so minimize the risk type of thing.

    I will look at the forced abscond, but it is the wrong time of year to be trying much
     

Share This Page

Loading...