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flash4cash

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Everything posted by flash4cash

  1. Co Op are what you make them. A well preforming Co Op should be hard to beat on pay out. They can be terrible as well look at fonterra, does not focus on branded products but stays with commodities. A co op to sell bulk honey will not be a worthwhile pursuit long term. By the sounds of things the last co op failed as people stopped supplying it to chase the any honey into manuka game. That was a rare event and unlikely to be repeated again. Rules as I have mentioned before could also stop people bailing to protect everyone. I sure you are aware that we belong to a co op. It fantastic we love it. Sure we have a mumble here and there about things but overall we would not leave. I am sure you would find the same with tatua, or zespri. Why? because when done right co op are a great thing to be a part of. To make this point clearer. Our main competition in the goat infant formula game is the Dutch. They supply a brand owner on a contract basis. Our product sell for similar prices international. Their payout they receive for their milk is 1/3 of ours. That is right 33c in the dollar for what we get. Why because we are part of a co op that owns the brands. I am not suggesting that the margin is that big in the honey game. But it is a valid point to make.
  2. The brand is was already successful. The beekeepers are now directing and selling their honey into it. This allows them to actually sell honey each year with certainty and receive the best price for it. A brand owner will always want to arbitrate the difference. Co op ownership takes away this friction. 10's of millions are required for this. Option 2 is harder. I could see a few pop up with time, however I think it will unlikely make it to a co op model. This could be done with less but take vastly more time at least 2/3 years.
  3. A co op has 2 chances of succeeding in my book. The 1st is for a group of beekeepers to buy out and existing strong brand like Airbourne for example. The 2nd is to become innovative with the honey. This means the honey will be a characteristic product and not the main ingredient. Think something like Honey water. Neither solution is a quick fix, nor will it be cheap. If you do not have capital to contribute you are not part of the solution sorry. You do not have to own the entire brand yourself. You can bring in a distributor partner and go halved. Distribution is the biggest challenge to any product. Branding is also very challenging. To be successful you need to do the 2 together.
  4. It simple Adam. They come together with a common goal and that is to create value. They do this by forming a solid brand and extract a premium over the commodity price. Number one rule for success in consumer products is own the brand. Bee keepers are getting killed right now because they failed to own the brand, with the brand owner putting the cheapest honey they can find into their brand.
  5. I wonder why that would be? To time complicated to administer? It is certainly fairer given the the vast difference in honey prices.
  6. Well in the goat industry after the 2nd major bust was simplify who is left standing. They then spent 5 years or so milking goats for nothing, freezing the milk and driving it to the airport so it could be sent to Ozzy to go into infant formula trails. So it sorts out thouse that are committed to the game, money or nothing. I suspect honey industry is about to experience a similar outcome. With the right leadership nz honey could come back strong if they are smart. Most of us however will not be here. Let me just say the bees are fun but not everything in life. Family, friends and your health are far more important. There is respect to anyone whom decided to move on.
  7. Sorry to keep banging on about the goat industry but it worth highlighting 2 points from their quota model. The first is if you do not do your quota then they have the discretion to charge you 1/3 of the payout on under supply. Second is the board have the discretion to redeem your shares for 1 cent in the dollar. So that stops anyone trying underhanded tactics like to put cow milk in the vat. To my knowledge neither cause has even been implemented. But you need sticks to keep people honest and for the co op greater good.
  8. Probably. My theory is that if you put 100% of your hives up for treatment you are going ball deep regardless of scale. I also love that fact he drove 2 hours from taupo to drop me off 10 strips..twice I reckon they worked it was all I used last season for Autumn and did not even do a spring treatment.
  9. Awe what about me? You dropped of the thins and I asked what is the the success rate? Philbee replys " not sure you are the 1st customer, tell me how they go"
  10. Mods can you please delete the above I have made a calculation error. I will repost a correct version. Cheers
  11. Who was the major benefactor of the last round of industry funded research? MANUKA Who can afford it right now? MANUKA... Milk that cow. If you consider it fair that 10 cent per kg on $4 honey then this is 2.5%. Applying the same logic yet this time only to mono manuka and multi then you could easily raise your $20 million ($30 kg average assumption) apply it at export point and you will capture 9,500 tons this way. So roughly half of all honey produced. Let's assume a more palatable 50 cents per kg then you would have just under $5 million (on total mono manuka and multi exports of $275 million). Or 1.67% 2.5 x your $2 million and 10 x more fair. All the money raised should go into non manuka market development. Then we can all afford to contribute to a levy..then we will have a strong and balanced industry. **these numbers are just a best guest from memory of nz honey export and average price** The principle remains the same. And everyone gets a say. 1 shareholder 1 vote regardless of size or honey produced.
  12. The levy money is chump change, $2 million...that will not go far. Even with the government matching some of the research funding. You get sweet F all for 1/2 million in research dollars. It is the control of the industry that is the real prize, the rights to write the rules. That is what the big boys are after.
  13. If your livelihood is on the line then it does not matter how many hive you have you are still in the same boat. Our goat farm is the 2nd biggest producer in terms of milk solids and the lady down the road is the 2nd smallest. We both get the same vote at a meeting. If we want change then we have to convince her it is worth it, and not going to disadvantage her business. Because at the end of the day the big boys will use their power to get there way. We do all the time. So it has to be 1 person one vote or the big boy will screw the little people.
  14. You are being to näive. Everybody would love to only have half the hives in NZ. They just want everyone else to be the one to take the hit. The bigs boys get that way because they are aggressive. If they can use compliance cost to crush their competition they will. Look at the board members there are the big players on there. They would love to crush the small players and remove them from the market, more money for them.
  15. What i think Ali is trying to say is that while we appricated the reasearch and science side of things..it feels like that is the decoy to a side agenda of control of the bee industry in nz by this organisation. One area I find interesting is market access. So it could used by speical interest group to reduce competition by making the complicant cost if producing honey so complex and expensive that small operators can not compete.
  16. Take out a few frames with wet honey in them and shake it horizontally onto a lid. If nectar fails out then it was collected in the past day or so.
  17. I have had quite a few hive swarm on me in January. Took my eye off them for a few weeks and bam. I expected that once i was past the longest day i would be ok. I wonder whether the philbee staples mid season treatment contributed to this ? however I think it more a case of just running bees in doubles that got me...ran out of boxes
  18. Wow!! Got a pic of the the finger before reattachment? I love how in the heat of the moment you though...need pics.
  19. I agree things have really dried up. 3 weeks ago I was sick of rain...now where is the rain..aye the life of a farmer. We are getting patchy regrowth on our paddocks now.
  20. @Philbee OMG. Try to find the right emoji but i could not find one.
  21. I know that is why i do not say anything to them. I just buy them direct from China myself. I was suprised at how well they were doing in terms of year on year turnover. It was down but not nearly as bad as I would have thought. I would have pick double what it was. Not helped by me so far i have brought 1 pair of new gloves this season that my total spend. Plus some Philbee Staples.
  22. When I mentioned to a certain manager about the competitors catalogue he said he had not seen it. Interesting it been out for weeks and you have not looked at your major competitions price structures...this is after they change them...no need they already know what the prices will be ?
  23. @Alastair just look at how they all market up the price of the imported pieces. Take a j hive tool. They buy them for US99c each from china and sell them for $13. How is it they all have exacatly the same margins on them all? It is classic price fixing. Same thing across most of their products.
  24. So for us that sux at maths are you saying a mated queen is worth $18.18? (10/2.2) x $4 = $18.18
  25. I do not think so i would alleged that there is price fixing going on by the 3 main supply companies. If the commerce commission investigated I say there would be some hefty fines given out.
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