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infamous cash crop of South Hokianga

I don't know about pesticides, but this year it has certainly seen a fair bit of herbicide. the pork choppers were cruising around noisily in the big waka topatopa for weeks......

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it's in the combo, Grant. nuc all insects with the nic and then the weeds with round up and only monsanto"s gen manupulated crop still stands. isn't it great? brave new world! yeah!

Most people mix at twice the necessary dilution rate and apply dilute at 5 times the necessary rate and if it isnt scorched earth after 2 days they re-apply. When spraying you only need to make the t

Maby you should look at doing a vid about weed/grass control around hives @Trevor Gillbanks

The oldest kiwifruit vines are over 50 years old with no problems. What weight of copper per ha per year do you think they are using and you think is appropriate?

 

I've no idea, that is why I am asking. Also, has the rate of application of copper remained the same in 50 years? My impression is that it has increased a lot. Copper is widely used in all of horticulture. Does Kiwifruit use the same as everyone else? My impression is that it uses far more than tomatoes etc. What's the real story?

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I've no idea, that is why I am asking. Also, has the rate of application of copper remained the same in 50 years? My impression is that it has increased a lot. Copper is widely used in all of horticulture. Does Kiwifruit use the same as everyone else? My impression is that it uses far more than tomatoes etc. What's the real story?

Zespri allow (I think) 6 kg of active ingredient per ha per year, our worst year of psa we almost used 4. That resulted in significant canopy damage from repeating the use of copper.

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Zespri allow (I think) 6 kg of active ingredient per ha per year, our worst year of psa we almost used 4. That resulted in significant canopy damage from repeating the use of copper.

Your point is a good one.

 

The kg/copper per hectare has actually decreased markedly over the past 10-30 years or so, due to new fungicides coming on the market. Old traditional fungicides such as bordeaux mix (copper sulphate and hydrated lime) or copper oxychloride contained high levels of elemental copper and were routinely used at high application rates and a number of times each season. While these particular copper fungicides are still available and able to be used, they are used rarely now. With improvements in formulation technology, new copper fungicides use a tiny fraction of the traditional amount of copper per hectare. And other, non-copper fungicides, have also replaced a lot of copper use. So a single application of something like Bordeaux mix would have applied more elemental copper than the full-season use @Kiwifruiter mentions above.

 

Having said that, when copper hits soil, it really doesn't go anywhere - so it can and will build up and you are right to ask the question @ChrisM . That is why Zespri has a policy on total elemental copper applied per season. Other horticulture sectors (think winegrapes, apple/pear, summer fruits, vegetables such as potatoes, onions and tomatoes) are also all concerned and working on this.

 

Orchard areas that traditionally had apple/grapes and some other uses, for a large number of years, and are now being used for housing, have copper contaminant issues with soil. I'm not going to name those areas, but if you use your imagination around rapidly expanding cities that traditionally had those crops around them and now don't, you can probably work it out.

 

Lastly, I can't resist, but the comment re growing tomatoes around Genoa - I've travelled extensively in Italy while working in horticulture, and most of their soils are so ruined from such a long period of cultivation, it consistently surprises me that they can produce anything in them at all. This isn't an Italian problem - its a result of a long period of human impact. While the Italians produce some fantastic quality vegetables in particular (and also fruits) they do so with a high level of intervention (lots of attention and inputs). Not because they've looked after their soils so well.

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Here's some light listening for peeps out there, and VERY valid, also pretty scary.

BUT what are the options? everyone focuses on what is bad but no one offers a solution.

The Undercurrent: why are we being fed by a poison expert? Monsanto and Roundup – video

 

So because there isn't a better product to kill kikuyu grass we have to poison ourselves and future generations? That means kikuyu will rule the world. Or depleted lands without kikuyu, humans or bees, for that matter....

 

In broad terms, James Lovelock Theory of Gaia (or Gaia hypothesis) implies that humans will succeed at killing the ecosystem, and eliminate themselves (ourselves) from the planet. However, after a few centuries (millennia, however long it takes), Gaia (the Earth) will recover and all life forms will begin again. Hopefully we live enough traces of our failed attempts for the second wave of humans to learn from ou(expletive removed) ups.

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So because there isn't a better product to kill kikuyu grass we have to poison ourselves and future generations? That means kikuyu will rule the world. Or depleted lands without kikuyu, humans or bees, for that matter....

 

In broad terms, James Lovelock Theory of Gaia (or Gaia hypothesis) implies that humans will succeed at killing the ecosystem, and eliminate themselves (ourselves) from the planet. However, after a few centuries (millennia, however long it takes), Gaia (the Earth) will recover and all life forms will begin again. Hopefully we live enough traces of our failed attempts for the second wave of humans to learn from our ups.

The stress of worrying about the above will poison your life. Our path is set, nothing you or I can achieve will change it. Enjoy what you have while you have it !(y)

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So because there isn't a better product to kill kikuyu grass we have to poison ourselves and future generations? That means kikuyu will rule the world. Or depleted lands without kikuyu, humans or bees, for that matter....

 

In broad terms, James Lovelock Theory of Gaia (or Gaia hypothesis) implies that humans will succeed at killing the ecosystem, and eliminate themselves (ourselves) from the planet. However, after a few centuries (millennia, however long it takes), Gaia (the Earth) will recover and all life forms will begin again. Hopefully we live enough traces of our failed attempts for the second wave of humans to learn from ou(expletive removed) ups.

The vast majority of people use roundup wrong, if used correctly the chances of enough hanging around to poison us is low.

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Explain please. I am all for using sprays in a more efficient manner.

Most people mix at twice the necessary dilution rate and apply dilute at 5 times the necessary rate and if it isnt scorched earth after 2 days they re-apply. When spraying you only need to make the target slightly moist. Spray onto concrete (with plain water) and check your pattern. You should be able to see dry concrete between the droplets. Its ok for grass to take a few weeks to die, the more time the chemical spends translocating around the plant the more root mass it will kill, in the end the grass around it will take a lot longer to creep back into the are. Also dont weedeat or mow before you spray, it needs to enter through the leaves to kill the roots.

 

A 1l bottle of generic roundup, can do graff control around a LOT of beehives.... (And, for the record, I play with agrichemicals for my day job...)

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It's a location thing. Most of my hives do not need any ground care as the lawn mower or stock keep everything clear.

That's a surprise, my hives on farm site the stock will not get closer than about a foot, which is really where you need the control.... Maby I need to tell them to HTFU...

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That's a surprise, my hives on farm site the stock will not get closer than about a foot, which is really where you need the control....

When I had trouble with NUCs being robbed I deliberately situated them with long grass in front of the entrances. Figured it would stop the robbers from barging straight in. Seemed to work.

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When I had trouble with NUCs being robbed I deliberately situated them with long grass in front of the entrances. Figured it would stop the robbers from barging straight in. Seemed to work.

Good idea, does work! It also makes it harder for the bees coming in with honey and makes it more susceptible to diseases in the hive...

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  • 1 year later...

The move to Bee Friendly takes another step in the (hopefully) right direction.

Bunnings bins pesticide thought to harm bees http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/348157/bunnings-bins-pesticide-thought-to-harm-bees

Mitre 10 to review bee-risk pesticides http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/country/348231/mitre-10-to-review-bee-risk-pesticides

 

Edited by Alanbee
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Great. So what exactly are we going to use instead? You do realise that these are some of the preferred weedkillers that Beekeepers use? 

Even the wording of the title tells you how unsure they are. 

"Bunnings bins pesticide thought to harm bees" 

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17 minutes ago, Grant said:

Great. So what exactly are we going to use instead? You do realise that these are some of the preferred weedkillers that Beekeepers use? 

Even the wording of the title tells you how unsure they are. 

"Bunnings bins pesticide thought to harm bees" 

Let's not be confusing pesticides with herbicides shall we !

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Agree @yesbut but here again the article  headlineis vague because it infers pesticides but the main article refers to the Bunnings ban on neonics in general. There is a reference to a pesticide as "one of the items included in the ban" 

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