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Philbee

Crane trailer

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thank goodness for good brakes !

 

do you grease the ball?

high un-sprung mass makes the suspension bounce more. it the sheer weight of the trailer which helps as it makes the springs work.

i would not be to surprised if part of the ball wear is due to triple axle design. they are a poor load sharing setup and the change of trailers center axis could be loading up the ball to much. this gets quite bad even with light offroad and half decent 4x4 suspension. ie the tow vehicle rear moves up/down to much.

triples are more suited to good tarseal with a stiff sprung tow vehicle.

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thank goodness for good brakes !

 

do you grease the ball?

high un-sprung mass makes the suspension bounce more. it the sheer weight of the trailer which helps as it makes the springs work.

i would not be to surprised if part of the ball wear is due to triple axle design. they are a poor load sharing setup and the change of trailers center axis could be loading up the ball to much. this gets quite bad even with light offroad and half decent 4x4 suspension. ie the tow vehicle rear moves up/down to much.

triples are more suited to good tarseal with a stiff sprung tow vehicle.

I dont grease the ball because of the pumice dust that would accumulate in the grease but may do so from now on and clean the grease off and replace weekly.

Triples are at a disadvantage over some types of tracks due to the load sharing limitations but their advantages far outweigh the cons.

For example when doing a 3 point turn on a narrow track I can back the thing over a huge drain or bank so that only the front pair of wheels is holding the trailer up.

A tandem would simply vanish into the hole.

I will build another one next year exactly the same, but with a pin and eye tow hitch.

The main cause of the coupling wear has been trailer roll relative to the truck.

There is one place in my rounds where the side edge of the coupling hits the neck of the ball.

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You need to drill & thread a wee hole in the top of the coupling, then thread a funnel into it, keep funnel filled with oil. That'll stop dust from accumulating in it (y)(y)(y)(y)(y)

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You need to drill & thread a wee hole in the top of the coupling, then thread a funnel into it, keep funnel filled with oil. That'll stop dust from accumulating in it (y)(y)(y)(y)(y)

The problem is the mess. white food grade grease would be less of an issue

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I dont grease the ball because of the pumice dust that would accumulate in the grease but may do so from now on and clean the grease off and replace weekly.

Triples are at a disadvantage over some types of tracks due to the load sharing limitations but their advantages far outweigh the cons.

For example when doing a 3 point turn on a narrow track I can back the thing over a huge drain or bank so that only the front pair of wheels is holding the trailer up.

A tandem would simply vanish into the hole.

I will build another one next year exactly the same, but with a pin and eye tow hitch.

The main cause of the coupling wear has been trailer roll relative to the truck.

There is one place in my rounds where the side edge of the coupling hits the neck of the ball.

just a smear of grease. not to much that will fill with crap and end up as valve grinding paste.

 

the 4wd couplings are a good idea. sounds like your pushing the limits of standard coupling anyway.

but i think the big part of the problem is your 4wding a trailer thats setup for tarsel roads.

they are not designed for putting all the load on one axle and hanging the other two in mid air. i would be finding a better place or method to turn around.

you would be scrubbing the tires fairly badly on the turns, which is hard on the spring hangers.

 

its catch 22 as they don't really make offroad trailers for 3.5 ton.

 

probably the nearest compromise is a walking beam with individual springs on each axle. that allows the tow ball and hitch to move without changing load center.

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Most heavy duty trailed farm machinery is coming out with selfsteering/steerable rear axels and it certainly cuts down on tire scuffing as well as making tight gateways and sharp bends more manageable . I like the look of the aussie coupling . The bush should take a lot of the slop out that speeds up the wear process . Have a look at the tow eyes and draw bars of contractors fert spreaders and tractors . They flog too and thats with hourly greasing while in use .

How do you get on with punctures with the tri axel ? The tandems are great for punctures on the rear axel so would imagine a triple would be double trouble in that regard .

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Basically the trailer has been designed and built to take a beating.

Its only been let down by the Trojan coupling.

This one is incredibly light for its size but very strong.

Punctures dont seem to be an issue, neither is scuffing as most of its work is on dirt and grass.

I think the combination of a short wheelbase truck and long trailer works well in the bush.

Maybe not so well at highway speed.

As for finding someplace easier to turn around, I've got a job to do and spend all day in the bush going hard.

If I need to turn around, I just turn around.

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scuffing as most of its work is on dirt and grass.

you still get a lot of sideways pressure on those springs. something to check and keep an eye on.

 

your getting a wear problem rather than breakages, so its either faulty material or a design issue.

if its a design issue no matter what coupling you get your still going to have issues.

 

if you roughneck a tool thats not designed for the job then its going to fail and at the worse possible time.

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you still get a lot of sideways pressure on those springs. something to check and keep an eye on.

 

your getting a wear problem rather than breakages, so its either faulty material or a design issue.

if its a design issue no matter what coupling you get your still going to have issues.

 

if you roughneck a tool thats not designed for the job then its going to fail and at the worse possible time.

When you start to really investigate couplings you discover that Trojan are very mainstream.

What they call heavy duty is just there opinion and isn't backed up by anything.

In the old days Trojan made good stuff but now its a differnt story.

I have 4 trailers that use Trojan running gear and its nothing special.

There are much better systems out there but you just dont see them often.

I may try a dry silicon lube as well

JUST MY OPINION BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE OF COURSE

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we had the hydraulic dampner replaced, then rebuilt. got sick of it and replaced it with a spring one (horrible but it sorta works) new master cylinder was faulty and the new coupling was jammed.

i'm not fond of trojan gear at the mo.

 

its just difficult to get good gear here.

 

BUT, the reason for that is the customers. kiwis build excessively heavy poorly designed trailers at cheapest possible price and abuse them. so companies do not import the good gear because knuckle dragging kiwis will not buy it.

then you can't get the good gear so you have to resort to building them excessively heavy. making it all self-fulfilling.

 

why nz doesn't have the good spring and shock dampened couplings i do not know. dime a dozen overseas but we get stuck with simple spring ones.

 

trojan have come out this year with ventilated disks. finally, probably the last trailer company to do so. kiwis think small sold disk that came out on a 70's small car is suitable for controlling 2.5 ton.

 

years ago i asked alko if they had any of their trailer shocks in stock. they didn't know they even made them, let alone import them and no one had ever asked for them. today you can buy them easy enough.

monroe where the same. they make them, but don't import them and no one ever asked for them.

 

the other day i was following a car towing a small trailer, typical company made one. nice galvanized with crate. on a good flat road, it was going airborne when hitting small bumps that i could barely feel in the ute.

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we had the hydraulic dampner replaced, then rebuilt. got sick of it and replaced it with a spring one (horrible but it sorta works) new master cylinder was faulty and the new coupling was jammed.

i'm not fond of trojan gear at the mo.

 

its just difficult to get good gear here.

 

BUT, the reason for that is the customers. kiwis build excessively heavy poorly designed trailers at cheapest possible price and abuse them. so companies do not import the good gear because knuckle dragging kiwis will not buy it.

then you can't get the good gear so you have to resort to building them excessively heavy. making it all self-fulfilling.

 

why nz doesn't have the good spring and shock dampened couplings i do not know. dime a dozen overseas but we get stuck with simple spring ones.

 

trojan have come out this year with ventilated disks. finally, probably the last trailer company to do so. kiwis think small sold disk that came out on a 70's small car is suitable for controlling 2.5 ton.

 

years ago i asked alko if they had any of their trailer shocks in stock. they didn't know they even made them, let alone import them and no one had ever asked for them. today you can buy them easy enough.

monroe where the same. they make them, but don't import them and no one ever asked for them.

 

the other day i was following a car towing a small trailer, typical company made one. nice galvanized with crate. on a good flat road, it was going airborne when hitting small bumps that i could barely feel in the ute.

 

Today I spoke with the head Trojan Technician in Wiri,

While discussing the coupling issue I asked him why the spring geometry in the Triple kit was supplied with components that positioned the rear axial 50mm higher (Less loaded) than the front two axles

This set up effectively makes the trailer tail heavy and liable to sway at speed.

He told me that they did this so the third (rear) axial carried less weight and was less inclined to scuff on tight turns.

 

I would never dream of fitting that system to my trailer so changed it during fabrication.

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Today I spoke with the head Trojan Technician in Wiri,

While discussing the coupling issue I asked him why the spring geometry in the Triple kit was supplied with components that positioned the rear axial 50mm higher (Less loaded) than the front two axles

This set up effectively makes the trailer tail heavy and liable to sway at speed.

He told me that they did this so the third (rear) axial carried less weight and was less inclined to scuff on tight turns.

 

I would never dream of fitting that system to my trailer so changed it during fabrication.

i wonder if thats actually done for a different reason.

that might explain some that i've seen with pivot point already on max.

 

if the rear pivot is up for the rear axle that would help with the inherent design problem a triple has.

when the 1st axle goes up it forces the 2nd down, which forces the 3rd up, resulting in 3rd coming off the ground. if the 3rd is placed up so it can't go up on the pivot point, then it will stay on the ground. but it would still allow it to go down when the situation is reversed.

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My new trailer got its first run today, It is still to have a crane fitted but other than that it is finished.

The crane will go between the front two axles.

It weighs in at 680kg as is plus 350kg for a crane.

It has Quadruple electric brakes and a front stowage box.

Deck is 2.2m x 4.4m[ATTACH=full]9632[/ATTACH]

Hey Philbee, where are you going for your crane? - I may be able to make some recommendations. Let me know what you are after.

 

P.S. Nice sized setup! :)

 

Cheers, Rusty.

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Hey Philbee, where are you going for your crane? - I may be able to make some recommendations. Let me know what you are after.

 

P.S. Nice sized setup! :)

 

Cheers, Rusty.

Phil made his own crane. Nice big unit with long reach. The crane isn't too bad either.

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image.jpeg.a92a30b663d5bd953eec9c2b0d4cfccc.jpeg

Does he have a pic at all?

Page 19 of the thread " show us your truck"

image.jpeg.a92a30b663d5bd953eec9c2b0d4cfccc.jpeg

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nice shiny wheels.

Looks good to me.

One question, with the triple axle choice. Do you guys ever consider having wheels at the very front and very back with a turntable and an A frame drawbar like a proper truck trailer? I'm just thinking it would go through the dips better without grounding at the ends and might be smoother ride and might go through tighter corners for the same deck length.

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LOL

Why ?

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nice shiny wheels.

Looks good to me.

One question, with the triple axle choice. Do you guys ever consider having wheels at the very front and very back with a turntable and an A frame drawbar like a proper truck trailer? I'm just thinking it would go through the dips better without grounding at the ends and might be smoother ride and might go through tighter corners for the same deck length.

Be very careful Chris, you could get a lashing from Tristran.

I definetly considered your idea.

My trailer use is extreme and I would wreck such a trailer but for some Beeks it could be a good rig to set up

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I would wreck such a trailer

How/why ? Too long/unwieldy ?

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My new trailer got its first run today, It is still to have a crane fitted but other than that it is finished.

The crane will go between the front two axles.

It weighs in at 680kg as is plus 350kg for a crane.

It has Quadruple electric brakes and a front stowage box.

Deck is 2.2m x 4.4m[ATTACH=full]9632[/ATTACH]

What crane are you using? one of the best for this setup is Quicklift cranes.

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What crane are you using? one of the best for this setup is Quicklift cranes.

It's a @Philbee Awesome. See post #42 above. Calling it a @Philbee Special wouldn't do it justice.

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