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Beekeeping on the west coast of the South Island

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I would like to have control over both queen and drone blood lines if I decide to retain some traits. ?

 

What traits are you wanting to retain that needs a closed breeding program?

 

are you wanting to make money from raising and selling production queens or are you wanting to set up a breeding program to concentrate on certain traits that aren't available as consistently in an open breeding operation?

 

Most beekeepers are wanting queens that are well mated, Produce gentle bees and lots of honey, they dont care so much how pretty she is or whether she has been bred in a coised or open population.

 

What you are proposing Dosnt make any sense to me, i can't think of anything worse than running a queen rearing operation in two areas hundreds of miles apart.

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What you are proposing Dosnt make any sense to me,

 

Having said that, it dosnt matter whether it makes sense to me as long as it makes sense to you :)

.

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What traits are you wanting to retain that needs a closed breeding program?

 

I would like to firstly select on manuka production and work in with my commerical manuka beek friend to achieve this, secondly I would like to give VSH a go via using the methods described in literature to select for this trait, also play around with other traits. I believe it may be worth selecting for both mum and drones, for example, select donor hives based on Manuka production for both virgin queens and drone population. I'm not really sure if it's worth going to this degree, but at least i would like to experiment and try and the only way to do that is with some isolation .

 

are you wanting to make money from raising and selling production queens or are you wanting to set up a breeding program to concentrate on certain traits that aren't available as consistently in an open breeding operation?

 

Both really, my mate whom I'm doing it with is more interested in open mated breeding, where as I want to focus on AI.

Most beekeepers are wanting queens that are well mated, Produce gentle bees and lots of honey, they dont care so much how pretty she is or whether she has been bred in a coised or open population.

 

I figured that, but how can you be sure a mated queen is going to produce lots of honey and remain gentle if there are many drones around from other apiaries?

 

What you are proposing Dosnt make any sense to me, i can't think of anything worse than running a queen rearing operation in two areas hundreds of miles apart.

 

I really get where you are coming from, it doesn't make much sense to me either yet, I fully appreciate you opinion as I would be lost without guidance! In terms of running two operations, it's possible I could live here in Christchurch, while my friend lives in Karamea or we could simply do a big shift over xmas once the weather settles in Karamea. In a lot of ways I would prefer to stay in Christchurch, but I'm also prepared to move to Karamea and forget about Canterbury.

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Tell exactly what youplan to do and,I can help.

 

As above, focus solely on selling nucs and mated queens, while also specializing in AI.

 

Thank you heaps for any help, I really appreciate it, I hope others can learn from my questions too.

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to be totally honest its probably best to concentrate on getting the basics right first. selecting for manuka foraging in preference to other nectar sources is something I doubt u will go anywhere achieving is it even possible?

 

beekeepers have been rearing queens in open mated situations for hundreds of years and have been able to retain the traits they desire.

AI queens are no good as production queens there would be a very limited market for them.

if u are wanting to turn queen rearing into a business you are probably going down the wrong path. if you are doing it your own learning and interest then its all good.

im sure others will think differently tho :)

.

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Ok a few pointers from a coaster.How are you going to control the mating with ferals out there.The black drones will beat the yellow ones.The blacks seem to up earlier.Do you have a deca. If not get and be prepared to lose hives to afb. The reason I am saying that is your hives, if they are any good will most likely rob the dead feral hives in the bush and it does not matter how much you feed them they will go hunting. I know from experience.

Manuka, gathering hives to me a waste of time. If the temperature and other plants flowering the bees will always go for the easiest plant. Take this year, no kmahi but heaps of lotus. Lotus was jus toutside the front door whereas kamahi was up the hill. What would you do if you were a bee.

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to be totally honest its probably best to concentrate on getting the basics right first. selecting for manuka foraging in preference to other nectar sources is something I doubt u will go anywhere achieving is it even possible?

 

I agree, it would appear that I'm trying to run before I can walk. I didn't mean to suggest that there is such a thing as Manuka foraging preference, but considering the only beek whom I'm close to in person works Manuka, I figure it's an easy opportunity to gauge general honey yield for queens I rear, at least it may be a good real world test for them.

 

beekeepers have been rearing queens in open mated situations for hundreds of years and have been able to retain the traits they desire.

 

Though there are a lot more hives around now, so I guess retaining traits is becoming increasingly difficult?

 

 

AI queens are no good as production queens there would be a very limited market for them.

 

I think it' worth a shot to try and attempt to bring the cost of production queens down, though I see this as being a fair way down the line.

if u are wanting to turn queen rearing into a business you are probably going down the wrong path. if you are doing it your own learning and interest then its all good.

im sure others will think differently tho :)

 

What path would you take if you were starting out? The number one for me is selling mated queens and nucs, so I'm all ears (eyes) about the most appropriate path to take.

 

Thanks Frazz again. :)

.

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Ok a few pointers from a coaster.How are you going to control the mating with ferals out there.The black drones will beat the yellow ones.The blacks seem to up earlier.Do you have a deca. If not get and be prepared to lose hives to afb. The reason I am saying that is your hives, if they are any good will most likely rob the dead feral hives in the bush and it does not matter how much you feed them they will go hunting. I know from experience.

Manuka, gathering hives to me a waste of time. If the temperature and other plants flowering the bees will always go for the easiest plant. Take this year, no kmahi but heaps of lotus. Lotus was jus toutside the front door whereas kamahi was up the hill. What would you do if you were a bee.

 

Mating with ferals? That's a good point, they are certainly around since it wasn't long ago they were living in my mates lounge wall. I thought it's normal these days to have a small amount of European black bee in a lot of Italian blood lines? Maybe I have to find a way to work with those genetic influences.

 

I'm on my way to getting DECA, is feral hives spreading AFB quite a big issue on the west coast, what should of infection rates would I expect?

 

It seems like it might be a tuff gig in Karamea, not sure if the benefit of isolation will justify being there. I guess Canterbury has it's own challenges too.

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Now you tell me where the ferals are inCanterbury.I have no idea of the infection rate but decide how many beehives you can afford to lose at $500.00 plus/hive.I ted to disagree with what you sayabout precentage of dark bees in italian stock.If it is it is Carne stock.Good luck.

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^ Great reply BSB, very thoughtful and well written.

 

Chasing honey seems to me also very difficult with a lot of good sites already taken? Is honey like clover even profitable for those new to the industry?

 

I must ask, if you were me @BSB and wanted to focus on rearing queens and selling nucs, how would you go about finding a good location, would you also do as you suggested, start with honey first even though places like Canterbury are flooded with hives?

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would you also do as you suggested, start with honey first

 

You won't have a choice. You'll get honey full stop..

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If you are seriously looking to breed the quality and quantity of honey in your are isn't really that important which means you can place hives in areas others may not look at, and have sites/mating yards overlaping. You are looking for sites that are good for matings rather than good for honey. Driving, door knocking and talking to people is the only way in my experience....and it takes time :)

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If you are seriously looking to breed the quality and quantity of honey in your are isn't really that important which means you can place hives in areas others may not look at, and have sites/mating yards overlaping. You are looking for sites that are good for matings rather than good for honey. Driving, door knocking and talking to people is the only way in my experience....and it takes time :)

 

 

As an aside @BSB have you stumbled across any DCA's in your perambulations ?

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As an aside @BSB have you stumbled across any DCA's in your perambulations ?

 

I would so love to see one of these !

 

.

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You won't have a choice. You'll get honey full stop..

 

Yea I get that, but it might not be that good to me if if it contains tutin or crystallizes easily.

 

If you are seriously looking to breed the quality and quantity of honey in your are isn't really that important which means you can place hives in areas others may not look at, and have sites/mating yards overlaping. You are looking for sites that are good for matings rather than good for honey. Driving, door knocking and talking to people is the only way in my experience....and it takes time :)

 

That's very doable in Karamea, it's a good stretch of coast line with a few semi isolated valleys and no hives in site, I may be able to get fussy and place them in strategic spots.

 

As an aside @BSB have you stumbled across any DCA's in your perambulations ?

 

DCA?

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DCA - try Google

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DCA - try Google

 

drone congregation area, silly abbreviations, sorry it's a bit early in the morning. :P

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Hello, we live on wangapeka road and have a few hives. We would be keen to get some new bees of different genetics - how is your progress on your project going? Would be good to keep in touch perhaps we can be of help to each other? Regards

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Hello, we live on wangapeka road and have a few hives. We would be keen to get some new bees of different genetics - how is your progress on your project going? Would be good to keep in touch perhaps we can be of help to each other? Regards

 

@Roy Arbon

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Hello, we live on wangapeka road and have a few hives. We would be keen to get some new bees of different genetics - how is your progress on your project going? Would be good to keep in touch perhaps we can be of help to each other? Regards

Hi,No problem.Most of my bees are amm crosses but am working to pure amm.There is already a commercial beek in Karamea.How far away is the nearest beek to you.Now I am talking in a straight line.Not by road.

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Hi @Roy Arbon

Are you splitting any hives soon? We would like to get some bees into the hives we have empty.

 

I am not sure how far the nearest beekeeper is to us in a straight line, none of our direct neighbours have bees, and I posted on here in hope to connect with people I haven't been able to meet in person yet. I may be meeting the commercial beekeeper here later this week as a good local acquaintance is going to get us in touch, which will be good. We just want to expand our hives for home use and for the family, as well as using the wax as we keen woodworkers and do a bit of leather work too.

 

Hope you and your bees have been enjoying the sun this week.

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