HiveAlive 1 Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 Hi everyone, My name is Linda and I am a researcher with a company called Advance Science who make HiveAlive. I am interested in learning more about beekeeping in New Zealand and requirements of beekeepers. HiveAlive is a complementary feed for bees. I would love to get feedback from any of you who have used it, feel free to contact me anytime. Also, if you have any questions about its use, please let me know. For more information about the product, check out our website, Advance Science - HiveAlive - Inspired by Nature - Designed by Science Looking forward to talking with you! Linda Link to post Share on other sites
The Paladin 43 Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 A friend of mine bought some for use this season, will be interested in seeing the results (which better be bloody amazing, considering the price) 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Beeman72 44 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 If you send me a sample I would be more than happy to give you some feedback 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Pbee 1,256 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Hi Linda, Same here, if you want something you have to give something in return! Send us some samples and we are more than happy to test them for you! In saying that, we here in NZ have a very special climate. Your product may or may not work! Best way to find out is to have 'field trials'! I am sure there are a good number of volunteers on this forum! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Debi Jacka 290 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Yes it would be good to see if it does better in one area as opposed to another. With any good research, you need to use a wide demographics in your study. Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Black 3,520 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Surely forty hives in Greece are enough! Link to post Share on other sites
Don Mac 318 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I agree with Dave, one trial of 40 hives is insufficient. If you are claiming that Hive Alive helps control Nosema and Chalkbrood, you will find that you will need to register your product here in NZ as an animal remedy. Agricultural compounds & veterinary medicines 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 146 Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 I have ordered some for use this spring...put the proverbials in the back pocket and bit the bullet. It'll be interesting... Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Black 3,520 Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 I suggest if you are trying it don't use it on all your hives, that way you can make some kind of comparison. Really, unless you have a lot of hives, all equalized at the start, you aren't going to be able to tell if there's a difference and, that the difference is worth the cost. Even then, you might notice something is different, but not know what it is. That goes for any kind of whimsey you might take up. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 146 Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 I suggest if you are trying it don't use it on all your hives, that way you can make some kind of comparison. Really, unless you have a lot of hives, all equalized at the start, you aren't going to be able to tell if there's a difference and, that the difference is worth the cost. Even then, you might notice something is different, but not know what it is.That goes for any kind of whimsey you might take up. I agree, thanks for that Dave. I think I will probably treat every second hive at this stage. Link to post Share on other sites
Don Mac 318 Posted August 6, 2014 Share Posted August 6, 2014 There have been some recent changes to our Fair Trading Act which require that any clams about a product must be substantiated. That means claims must be based on repeatable results from a number of trials. Full details are available from the Commerce Commission web site; Unsubstantiated representations | Commerce Commission I am like Dave, completely gobsmacked that Stalker can purchase a product based on marketing statements and one set of trial data. The new law change gives Stalker a claim opportunity on the supplier. Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 146 Posted August 7, 2014 Share Posted August 7, 2014 There have been some recent changes to our Fair Trading Act which require that any clams about a product must be substantiated. That means claims must be based on repeatable results from a number of trials.Full details are available from the Commerce Commission web site; Unsubstantiated representations | Commerce Commission I am like Dave, completely gobsmacked that Stalker can purchase a product based on marketing statements and one set of trial data. The new law change gives Stalker a claim opportunity on the supplier. I'm not sure if you are having a dig at me or the manufacturers...if it is me then don't lose sleep over it - I bought it with my eyes wide open. Thanks for the input though 1 Link to post Share on other sites
HiveAlive 1 Posted August 11, 2014 Author Share Posted August 11, 2014 To those who have bought the product, thank you very much for your purchase. HiveAlive was developed and manufactured in Ireland and has been in use here and across 20 countries for over 2 years, covering a wide range of climates. We agree with you trialling only half of your colonies so that you can see the benefits for yourself. Just to remind you, the revised feeding instructions are 2.5 ml of HiveAlive per litre of syrup, 4 litres per colony. This means one 500 ml bottle can feed up to 50 hives. We would like to give everyone a bottle of HiveAlive for trials but unfortunately we would not be in business if we did! All our trials are performed by research scientists in independent institutes. Saying that, if you want a free bottle we currently have a fun competition on Facebook to win bottles of HiveAlive. Check it out! HiveAlive - Galway, Ireland - Research Service | Facebook 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Popular Post Grant 4,298 Posted August 11, 2014 Popular Post Share Posted August 11, 2014 I am interested in learning more about beekeeping in New Zealand and requirements of beekeepers. HiveAlive is a complementary feed for bees. I would love to get feedback from any of you who have used it. Hi Linda and welcome. Please note that the topic is drifting from your initial enquiry of feedback into more active advertising. We do allow adverts but in the relevant section, please see Advertising on NZ Beekeepers | NZ Beekeepers Forum To learn more about beekeeping in NZ, you would need to read through the forums and ask questions that are appropriate to your research. We would like to give everyone a bottle of HiveAlive for trials but unfortunately we would not be in business if we did! Saying that, if you want a free bottle we currently have a fun competition on Facebook to win bottles of HiveAlive. Check it out! HiveAlive - Galway, Ireland - Research Service | Facebook If HiveAlive meets the criteria to be legally sold in New Zealand, then you would be most welcome to run a competition on NZ Beekeepers to give away free bottles of your product to your new potential marketplace. You currently have access to 1700 members, and countless visitors. We even have the facility to allow online purchases, should you wish to discuss NZ distribution. 5 Link to post Share on other sites
api mania 205 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 I have ordered some for use this spring...put the proverbials in the back pocket and bit the bullet. It'll be interesting... Just wondering @Stalker how the this product went for you? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 146 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Just wondering @Stalker how the this product went for you? It's probably a little hard for me to fairly rate HiveAlive, but in saying that I definitely don't have anything bad to say about it. I put it in all my sugar syrup last season, and especially made sure I gave my nucs a couple of feeds with it. My hives did very well with good populations and healthy looking fat shiny bees. My nucs built up quickly and I had minimal losses. However, I won't be using it this season as I have made my own brew using the same ingredients as HiveAlive. Thymol, lemongrass oil, spearmint oil, and Agrisea. These are emulsified into syrup using lecithin as an emulsifier and I have made an end product that looks and smells just like HiveAlive except it's not pink. I'm definitely not taking away from HiveAlive as I believe it is a good product and if it was a lot cheaper then I would be using it this season. Hope this helps! 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Jared@bex 196 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 We're did you get your thymol from? And if you don't mind me asking what is your recipe. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Stalker 146 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 We're did you get your thymol from? And if you don't mind me asking what is your recipe. I don't mind sharing my info with other beekeepers at all - sharing's caring, right? But this thread was started by Linda from HiveAlive so I don't really want to share my recipe undermining her product on her own thread. I may have said too much already (Foot in mouth is my specialty :oops:) If anyone wants to PM me with questions I'll be happy to help, or if there is a different thread going where this may be applicable I could share it there. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Trevor Gillbanks 6,846 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 If anyone wants to PM me with questions I'll be happy to help, or if there is a different thread going where this may be applicable I could share it there. Why not start a new thread explaining what you are doing and how it has affected your bees. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Popular Post api mania 205 Posted July 2, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted July 2, 2015 Just found this on a English bee club site, made me laugh so thought I would share. My beekeeping buddy was feeding syrup to his bees. As I watched him hunched over his hive, white-hooded, puffing smoke everywhere and muttering incantations, something occurred to me. “I reckon beecraft and witchcraft have a lot in common,” I opined. “In common?” he responded, but he wasn’t listening. “Well, look at us,” I continued. “It’s as if Hogwarts were hosting a meeting of the Ku Klux Klan.” I could just make out through the fug that he was looking at me askance, hive tool held aloft like Merlin’s wand. “What,” he said slowly, “are you going on about?” “Beecraft and witchcraft,” I explained. “Just think about it: The hooded outfits, incense burning, mumbo-jumbo, meetings of our coven on winter nights in the grounds of All Saints church ... and the magic potions.” “Potions?” he repeated. His echolalia is getting worse. “Yes,” I continued. “Witches favour ‘eye of newt and toe of frog, wool of bat and tongue of dog’ but beekeepers seem to prefer ‘head of fish, spit of walrus, oil of lemongrass and extract of thymus’.” There was a long pause and I began to feel uncomfortable because I wasn’t really confident about the fish heads and walrus spit. It could just as well be barnacle brains and jellyfish, but it is hard to be sure because all the manufacturer of a HiveAlive reveals about its ‘key ingredient’ is that it is a combination of marine bio-extracts. “Are you suggesting that I’m feeding my bees some sort of witches brew?” he challenged. This was going to be tricky so I decided to proceed with caution. “No...,” I replied, “but haven’t you ever wondered about that witches brew in Macbeth? I mean, why all the weird ingredients, and why are they so vague about the quantities? Would that magic potion still work without the newt’s eye for example, or would it be better if they put in two? ” “It’s just a story,” he replied. “Witches potions don’t really work magic. They put all that stuff in just to impress us.” “Like anti-wrinkle creams,” I suggested. “They always seem to contain microsomes and co-enzymes and other whacky things.” “I wouldn’t know,” he said somewhat defensively, “but I take your point. None of that stuff actually works.” I detected a trace of bitterness in that last remark and resolved to discretely take a closer look at him when the veils were off. “Well the fish heads might work,” I said reassuringly. “It really depends on whether you think your bees are deficient in marine bio-extracts. After all it says here on the bottle that HiveAlive is ‘A Nutritional Supplement’, so presumably you’ve worked out that what your bees need to perk them up is a shot of whelk wee and isopropyl-methyl-phenol.” “I saw what?” he queried. “Sorry, it’s just a posh word thymol, I explained. “ They make it by mashing plants up with sodium hydroxide, and then they pour hydrochloric acid on the gloop and out pop these crystals. But because they aren’t pure and are insoluble in water they have to dissolve them in a various solvents first before you can serve it up to your bees. It’s entirely natural apparently.” “Well I don’t think my bees are deficient in thymol,” he said, “or marine bio-extracts. I’m trying to stop my bees from getting nosema. The advertisement says HiveAlive is an alternative to Fumidil B.” “So ... it’s not really a nutritional supplement,” I mused. “But surely they aren’t recommending HiveAlive for treating or preventing nosema because that would be a medicinal claim which means it should be licensed as a veterinary medicine.” i “Dunno about that,” he replied airily, “But It cost me seventeen quid so it had better work.” Something smelt fishy, and it wasn’t just the marine bio-extracts. I decided to investigate further. It turns out that there are no controlled studies on HiveAlive to support its claim to be an alternative to Fumidil B. Neither are there data showing that it ‘strengthens’ bees against nosema. Instead, the manufacturer’s website makes reference to work by others who have investigated the properties of thymol and its effects on nosema. These lab-based studies and a 3-year field studyii suggest that thymol may indeed show some activity. However, because the dosage, product formulation, method of administration, timing and duration of treatment all varied, it’s impossible to extrapolate these findings to HiveAlive. So what about those marine bio-extracts? Well, despite being a ‘key ingredient’ no data are provided to support the assertion that they have ‘scientifically validated anti-microbial, anti-viral and anti-fungal properties’. Indeed an advertisement for HiveAliveiii states that efficacy is still to be verified, and their academic collaborator has also confirmed to me that she has yet to generate statistically significant results.iv This is probably just as well because if these compounds were shown to be active they would fall within the scope of the Biocidal Products Directivev and require formal testing and authorisation. Thymol, on the other hand, is an established and potent biocide. Traditionally a concentration of around 70ppm prevents sugar syrup from going mouldy. vi However, thymol seems to be unstable in water with a dissipation time (DT 50) of 16 daysvii so without formal stability studies it impossible to say whether an adequate concentration of thymol is maintained over time, especially if beekeepers make up and store bulk stock solutions. Nevertheless, if you must feed your bees adding 70ppm thymol to the syrup might make sense, and because solubilising thymol in water is a bit tricky, a readymade solution might seem more convenient, albeit expensive. But here’s the rub. True to witchcraft tradition, the manufacturer assiduously avoids mentioning the concentration of thymol in HiveAlive, thus implying everything, but potentially delivering nothing. So was my bee buddy feeding his bees a witches brew? Well he was plying them with indeterminate quantities of thymol and unspecified marine substances for an unlicensed indication. However, there were no newt’s eyes. And will the concoction prevent or treat nosema? Oh yes! But only if he says the magic words..... Its “hocus pocus!” 5 Link to post Share on other sites
Trevor Gillbanks 6,846 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Very good @api mania Link to post Share on other sites
AdamD 338 Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 In the UK, thymol crystals are available from the beekeeping suppliers. There was a study done which shows that thymol can be used for nosema - and is better than Fumidil B. The 'paper which describes it and a thymol mixture is shown on this web page here 1 Link to post Share on other sites
yesbut 6,230 Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 Interesting (y) Link to post Share on other sites
tristan 4,362 Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 In the UK, thymol crystals are available from the beekeeping suppliers. There was a study done which shows that thymol can be used for nosema - and is better than Fumidil B. The 'paper which describes it and a thymol mixture is shown on this web page here wrong nosema Field Trial of Several Nosema Treatments @ Scientific Beekeeping is probably better. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
AdamD 338 Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 The study I added a link to showed an improvement over years - something Randy Oliver didn't do. it would be good to see a repeat of the Pakistan study - especially now that n. ceranae is now common. Link to post Share on other sites
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