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tudor

Some odd bees

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Hi,

 

I noticed one hive has more dead bees out the front that I would like, but no obvious shivering like paralysis. Good number of bees in the hive, brood Ok and queen right.

 

I noticed some odd bees, one with no wings, one (not in pic) with one wing, and some with a pair.

Darker colour and shiny, is thie complete loss of hair.

 

I would value thoughts.

 

Thanks.

odd-bees-SAM_1170.jpg.0930fa4f29c5b1965e0cc497b622660f.jpg

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I have had the same looking bees in my hives from time to time. Iwould be interestig if someone could shedsome light on whether they are a genetic throwback to AMM or a mutated gene.

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I think its paralysis with a dose of DWV thrown in.

 

Dark hairless bees like in your photo are a giveaway for paralysis the deformed wings are not a symptom of paralysis but probably because the bee is affected by the paralysis virus its also more susceptible to DWV

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I think its paralysis with a dose of DWV thrown in.

 

Dark hairless bees like in your photo are a giveaway for paralysis the deformed wings are not a symptom of paralysis but probably because the bee is affected by the paralysis virus its also more susceptible to DWV

Yes, it seems to be lurking around even when I have re-queened most hives.

 

I hope it just settles down.

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Some paralysis found again yesterday, lots of dead bees out the front, the hive with lots of bees, brood and stores - nasty pic attached. And dark, hairless bees present, not that many.

Any intervention apart from re-queening ? Some reading suggests killing the colony, disposing of frames, burning boxes and restarting. What would you think ?

Or any other management strategies ?

Thanks.

paralysis-bees.jpg.845d66f3c8b178d2494f774883a49c80.jpg

paralysis-bees.jpg.845d66f3c8b178d2494f774883a49c80.jpg

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Requeening is the best option but not with any if your own queens get one from somewhere else

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Requeening is the best option but not with any if your own queens get one from somewhere else

Thanks.

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Given time and good conditions, hives can throw this off (assuming mite load is low). As per Frazz a different queen may give bees more resistant but it's a crap shoot.

 

Wouldn't go burning anything isreali paralysis is much wider spread in small doses than we might realise. About all you can do is ensure mite numbers are as low as possible, the bees are comfortably housed and have good nutrition.

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Some paralysis found again yesterday, lots of dead bees out the front, the hive with lots of bees, brood and stores - nasty pic attached. And dark, hairless bees present, not that many.

Any intervention apart from re-queening ? Some reading suggests killing the colony, disposing of frames, burning boxes and restarting. What would you think ?

Or any other management strategies ?

Thanks.

Hi - I am having similar problems with a hive here, since July. Have you requeened?

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Wouldn't go burning anything isreali paralysis is much wider spread in small doses than we might realise.

 

Hope not Alastair - the fact we don't have it is the only thing keeping honey imports out

We have Acute and Chronic paralysis viruses - I believe the hairless 'little blacks' are typically Chronic Bee Paralysis Virus.

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Oh, my mistake John. It was the "hairless blacks" I was thinking of but also, as a non scientist, I think we have something going on that didn't used to be happening, in terms of hives suddenly going listless and adult bees dying and acting like poisoned. See this in mine and other peoples hives.

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Hi - I am having similar problems with a hive here, since July. Have you requeened?

Yes, as cells become available I am requeening those which have lost strength, while I will requeen in summer those shaking off the virus, when I do "routine" requeening with more reliable mating.

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Oh, my mistake John. It was the "hairless blacks" I was thinking of but also, as a non scientist, I think we have something going on that didn't used to be happening, in terms of hives suddenly going listless and adult bees dying and acting like poisoned. See this in mine and other peoples hives.

you mean without the "hairless" symptom, @Alastair ?

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In these hives there is the odd hairless black shiny one but most bees don't show these symptoms.

 

John tested some bee samples I sent him last year and the culprit was very high DWV levels even though the mites had been dealt with it took virus levels longer to drop.

 

But I don't think that is the situation with the ones I'm seeing now although only a lab test would discover for sure.

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i see a few mysterious cases too. not varroa related. no visual symptoms.

will have to keep an eye on things.

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. . . .but also, as a non scientist, I think . . . . .

 

I think I've mentioned before I reckon good beekeepers are doing experiments/trials all the time. So the 'non-scientist' bit doesn't wash with me :)

On the other hand, people ask me if I am a beekeeper. I reply "no, I'm a bee-keep-them-alive-er" or a 'bee-don't-kill-them-immediately-er'. In a few years when I think I know a little more maybe I'll graduate to being a beekeeper.

 

 

. . . . I think we have something going on that didn't used to be happening, in terms of hives suddenly going listless and adult bees dying and acting like poisoned. See this in mine and other peoples hives.

 

I think this is DWV and possible N. ceranae. I think I've said it before but I think beekeepers suffer for a virus named after a visual symptom because its 'oh the bees' wings are fine, no virus'. When, unfortunately hives can dwindle/collapse from DWV without ever showing those symptoms. I suspect it may be to do with the timing of when the queen is infected but that's just my guess

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So I'm taking it from that John that the queen gets infected & passes DWV on to her bees in the eggs she lays? If that is so the only cure is a new queen?

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I think I've said it before but I think beekeepers suffer for a virus named after a visual symptom because its 'oh the bees' wings are fine, no virus'. When, unfortunately hives can dwindle/collapse from DWV without ever showing those symptoms.

 

what do you suggest then?

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So I'm taking it from that John that the queen gets infected & passes DWV on to her bees in the eggs she lays?

 

And drones.

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So I'm taking it from that John that the queen gets infected & passes DWV on to her bees in the eggs she lays? If that is so the only cure is a new queen?

 

I guess so.

 

 

And drones.

And there is the suggestion that Queens may also be infected during mating. I wonder if this explains some of the failing newly-mated queens that are new syndromes

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what do you suggest then?

Sorry Tom - no suggestions. Just explaining why some hives dwindle without apparent reason

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According to the screeds of stuff I've read lately (admitedly all of it translated from geekish papers into plain english)

DWV is a bit like AFB, present in most colonies but doesn't rear it's clinical symptoms bigtime unless a threshold is reached. In the case of DWV this appears to be heavy varroa investation. This has led to suspicion that the DWV virus is replicating within the varroa mites who then of course pass the dose on.

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Looked at a friends hive today. Thousands of dead bees out front, not hairless as mentioned above. I have attached a photo (good in side hive and one outside on ground (have a video and more photos but cant seem to upload it. . Filmed one bee land on her way to hive, slow down, crawl a bit and roll over and die. This hive was treated with Apistan taken out in May. Hive is two high and going very strong.10 frames of brood. No dead bees in hive.Pollen,honey, grubs brood a plenty. Could this be local spray? although Council said they had no scheduled spraying in area. but some neighbour possibly spraying?? Photo doesnt show full extent of how many bees dead. In the thousands .5992eaf8da662_Pdeadbees.JPG.095e275556f8e4b7f0a834652b6ca534.JPG

IMG_0523.JPG.0c59c5f0b11dd21a22eda8f732d2130b.JPG

5992eaf8da662_Pdeadbees.JPG.095e275556f8e4b7f0a834652b6ca534.JPG

IMG_0523.JPG.0c59c5f0b11dd21a22eda8f732d2130b.JPG

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You may be right, look likes its poisoned.

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