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Trevor Gillbanks

Archive Frames for Top Bar Hive

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Linda had some aluminium frames made for her top bar hive so that it will comply with NBA regulations about having keeping bee in a frame. She bought 2 of the frames to the Manawatu Bee Club feild day today and I took a couple of phtos so that anyone else out there considering building or buying a TBH can make it compliant. Top bars are 33mm wide. Aluminium frame is made from 25 x 3mm bar. Whilst these were not cheap they should last about 100 years or so.

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[quote="Trevor Gillbanks, post: 2624, member: 72"]Linda had some aluminium frames made for her top bar hive so that it will comply with NBA regulations about having keeping bee in a frame. She bought 2 of the frames to the Manawatu Bee Club feild day today and I took a couple of phtos so that anyone else out there considering building or buying a TBH can make it compliant. Top bars are 33mm wide. Aluminium frame is made from 25 x 3mm bar. Whilst these were not cheap they should last about 100 years or so.[/quote] Sorry about that. I hit the wrong button before I uploaded the photos and then could not upload the photos in the 5 min edit option so will try again. (The 5 min edit option is a pain). [attachment=985:name] This shows 2 frames together and with the require 8/9mm bee space. [attachment=987:name] This profile is made to suit the individual profile of the TBH. [attachment=986:name] This is how the frame were attached to the Top Bar. Easily removed if the top bar need replacing. Use Stainless steel screws. I hope this all helps.

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Trevor - these look fantastic. Do you have any issues with the gap between the aluminum ends when bars are side by side [I]in situ[/I]? Generally the top bar is the lid and in the configuration shown there will be a small gap - I guess it's 3mm deep and ?mm wide. Big enough for a small bee? or does it get proposed quickly? To fold the extrusion in then screw it would be a pain I know. Cheers

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[quote name='Roger']Trevor - these look fantastic. Do you have any issues with the gap between the aluminum ends when bars are side by side [I]in situ[/I]? Generally the top bar is the lid and in the configuration shown there will be a small gap - I guess it's 3mm deep and ?mm wide. Big enough for a small bee? or does it get proposed quickly? To fold the extrusion in then screw it would be a pain I know. Cheers[/quote] The overhang should not be a problem as the TPH has sloping sides and the dimensions are all made to give 8/9mm of bee spaces all around. As this is not my hive I cannot take photos of it to show what I mean but if you have a TBH then you will understand and see what I mean. It is important when making up the frames that you work out the bee space correctly and then the the bees will not fill it with propolise. As I write this I am wondering if the frame should be inset into the Top Bar. (is this what you are asking.) If so then this could be done very quickly with a router.

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[quote="Trevor Gillbanks, post: 2639, member: 72"]The overhang should not be a problem as the TPH has sloping sides and the dimensions are all made to give 8/9mm of bee spaces all around. As this is not my hive I cannot take photos of it to show what I mean but if you have a TBH then you will understand and see what I mean. It is important when making up the frames that you work out the bee space correctly and then the the bees will not fill it with propolise. As I write this I am wondering if the frame should be inset into the Top Bar. (is this what you are asking.) If so then this could be done very quickly with a router.[/quote] Hi Trevor - my query is whether the gap between two adjacent aluminum bars is enough to enable a bee to leave the hive. I understand the beespace issue between the bar and the side - my question is the gap at the top of where the bar sits on the top of the side panel. With the extrusions there will be a space 3mm deep (the depth of the aluminium bar) and X mm wide between two of the extrusions - will small bees be able to get out (or in?) through that resulting space? Or will bees propolise that gap in the ordinary course?

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[quote name='Roger']Hi Trevor - my query is whether the gap between two adjacent aluminum bars is enough to enable a bee to leave the hive. I understand the beespace issue between the bar and the side - my question is the gap at the top of where the bar sits on the top of the side panel. With the extrusions there will be a space 3mm deep (the depth of the aluminium bar) and X mm wide between two of the extrusions - will small bees be able to get out (or in?) through that resulting space? Or will bees propolise that gap in the ordinary course?[/quote] Yes Roger. I understood your question when I got about half way thru my reply and gave the answer then. I would suggest that the frames be rebated into the top bar by the required 25mm wide plus a bit and 3mm deep. This would help line up the frames when they are about to be screwed onto the top bar and would help prevent propolis build up. I would still put the saw cut into the top bar as a wax line.

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Thanks Trevor. I agree re the rebate or the alternative it to have the extrusion turned inwards and fastened on the inside of of the frame - awkward to screw I know. Cheers

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[quote name='Roger']Thanks Trevor. I agree re the rebate or the alternative it to have the extrusion turned inwards and fastened on the inside of of the frame - awkward to screw I know. Cheers[/quote] It is a lot easier to rebate. If you try and bend it inwards it will be past 90 deg and the chance of cracking the Aluminium is very high. Go for the router rebate.

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Also if it is bent inwards you will have trouble getting a screw driver in to fasten it in place.

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[quote name='Hobbler']Also if it is bent inwards you will have trouble getting a screw driver in to fasten it in place.[/quote] I agree as above but it could be easily achieved by using self tapping screws from the top. I still prefer the rebate option

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[quote="Trevor Gillbanks, post: 2673, member: 72"]I agree as above but it could be easily achieved by using self tapping screws from the top. I still prefer the rebate option[/quote] It is easy to make the rebate with a table saw, I made a small slide table with a square edge back board that sits in the mitre slide groove sit your bar on this and raise the saw to the required height then make multiple passes to clear the wood you want removed. I will try to get some pics tomorrow and post them to explain. Cheers - Daniel

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[quote name='dansar']It is easy to make the rebate with a table saw, I made a small slide table with a square edge back board that sits in the mitre slide groove sit your bar on this and raise the saw to the required height then make multiple passes to clear the wood you want removed. I will try to get some pics tomorrow and post them to explain. Cheers - Daniel[/quote] Sure. That is very simple to do. I would prefer to use a router table. and cut the groove lengthwise. This would have the added advantage of leaving a bit of wax in the groove when you remove the comb. and after the initial cut out there would be no need to rewax the goove. In the end it does not matter how you achieve it but it would be best to have the top of the bar flush with the frames. The bees will certainly not care. Whatever is easiest and safest. Trev

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