TV one news

[Dennis Crowley 1,351]

Im not trying to be an arse people but if things are not working for you at the moment, then go find out what will.

But there are many beeks who are doing very well at the moment, and the industry is in good shape, but not maybe the shape you use to.

[john berry 5,636]

If someone has a better beekeeper than me then fair enough.

If they are a better marketer than me that's also fair enough.

What annoys me is when the only thing they are good at is borrowing and spending other people's money.

It's not a level playing field when people start throwing millions of dollars around. When all the money has gone because of lousy crops caused by gross overstocking and multimillion dollar payouts to themselves they use their borrowing skills to borrow some more.

Perhaps I should just change with the times and crowd fund a few million dollars to save the bees and fund my retirement.

[jamesc 4,900]

Hmmm .....  the shape of the industry that I was used to  was one where I could seek counsel with honey buyers at the beginning of the season as to what they might be inclined to buy, and then we would plan accordingly, whether that was double queening 500 hives for  1000 boxes of comb honey on Clover, or putting bees into radish or carrot pollination, and finishing the season with a second crop of Honey Dew that  generally financed upgrading machinery in the operation.

We had one full time Beekeeper on and hired two or three casuals over the summer, with another two to work the extraction plant.

It was a lot of work, but bankrolled a growing family and  2000 acre beef and deer farming operation with one full time stockman.

 

Todays reality is half the amount of hives, one seasonal beekeeper who is on a four day week, and myself. No extracting crew as we do it ourselves, and a stock man who is also on a four day week , while the owner works an eight day week because the Missus is too Mena to pay wages.

Honey packers buy when they need a couple of drums to fulfil an order, and our long time buyer overseas tells me our honey is too expensive, and yet we are being offered almost the same price for it as we were back in the good 'ole days.

 

I liked the old days.

I'm not complaining about the Days of my life at the moment ..... It is what it is.

 

So what changed ?

 

 The change for us  came when Manuka rose in popularity.  We chased the gold up north, paid large royalties, helicopter fees , extortionate extraction fees and storage fees, not to mention wages .....$96k to beekeepers with two years experience ....

It was  a gravy train for all involved.... sort of.

The final year we made a loss of almost 200k and came home having lost half million dollars worth of assets .... somewhere.

 

You are right @Dennis Crowley ..... it should be an industry that is vibrant and optimistic ....it has the potential to be .... but at the moment is experiencing severe restructuring pains..... and that is not what I call 'Good Shape'.

 

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

7 hours ago, Dennis Crowley said:

Im not trying to be an arse people but if things are not working for you at the moment, then go find out what will.

But there are many beeks who are doing very well at the moment, and the industry is in good shape, but not maybe the shape you use to.

From my position, it's not. 

 

[Dennis Crowley 1,351]

8 minutes ago, jamesc said:

but at the moment is experiencing severe restructuring pains.

Yes it is, but there is still a beekeeping industry, but it's going to be different to what we used to, so us (being the collective us) need to find our spot in that difference. But if we don't want to move with the change then yes we will find it difficult, those that can find their spot will continue to do well and feel their in good shape.

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

4 minutes ago, Dennis Crowley said:

Yes it is, but there is still a beekeeping industry, but it's going to be different to what we used to, so us (being the collective us) need to find our spot in that difference. But if we don't want to move with the change then yes we will find it difficult, those that can find their spot will continue to do well and feel their in good shape.

Our spot?

Give us a few examples of beekeepers finding their niche/spot.

What change? 

 

 

[jamesc 4,900]

My spot .....  I showed you the budget the other day.  

0.43c/hive margin for a south island hive.

$450 ish for a N. Island hive.

 

Gino is not sure about my budget ..... but it gives me an idea of where my spot should be. 

 

Room for another skinny bee keeper to muscle in next to @Dennis Crowley ..... I could bring The Stripper and The Tool for a show and tell .....

 

 

[frazzledfozzle 7,483]

46 minutes ago, Gino de Graaf said:

Our spot?

Give us a few examples of beekeepers finding their niche/spot.

What change? 

 

 

I too would be very keen to see some examples.

 

I imagine it’s the Manuka chasers that are still making money but which ones ?

is it the ones that own their own land ?

is the ones packing and marketing their own honey ?

who are these beekeepers that are doing well what are they doing the rest of us aren’t ?

 

I look around me here at the top of the south and am surrounded by beekeepers who have been around for 40-50 years and ALL of them are having trouble surviving.

All of them have unsold honey in the shed and no interest.

 

The next squeeze will be on pollination with heaps of beekeepers chasing cashflow the prices will go down.

 

The beekeeping industry is bigger than just Manuka honey producers and I would suggest a majority of them are finding it tough.

Edited August 24, 2020 by frazzledfozzle

[NickWallingford 317]

There seems to be some upset that ApiNZ has generated publicity indicating that the industry is in good shape...

 

If she had said 'the industry is suffering', she would be widely roasted for pessimism.

 

If she had said nothing, others would be wondering 'why support the industry body if it doesn't do anything'.

 

I share the concerns about the economic state of the industry, but as others are saying (I think) the resolution, the future profitability, is more (not all) in your own hands and decision-making.

 

 

[Maggie James 899]

15 hours ago, jamesc said:

not yet... but ..... I have honey on toast for breakie everyday, honey Sammies for lunch..... haven't had a cold for years ... and managed to avoid Covid so far.

Try some honey for rooting!  By all accounts it's hard to miss

 

(Actually I am talking about plant propagation, instead of hormone powder.  Wonder if it works with manuka plantings, or whatever the next dream floral source will be)

[jamesc 4,900]

1 hour ago, NickWallingford said:

There seems to be some upset that ApiNZ has generated publicity indicating that the industry is in good shape...

 

If she had said 'the industry is suffering', she would be widely roasted for pessimism.

 

If she had said nothing, others would be wondering 'why support the industry body if it doesn't do anything'.

 

I share the concerns about the economic state of the industry, but as others are saying (I think) the resolution, the future profitability, is more (not all) in your own hands and decision-making.

 

 

Sometimes it's better to be honest than try to instil a false sense of optimism.

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

3 hours ago, frazzledfozzle said:

I too would be very keen to see some examples.

 

I imagine it’s the Manuka chasers that are still making money but which ones ?

is it the ones that own their own land ?

is the ones packing and marketing their own honey ?

who are these beekeepers that are doing well what are they doing the rest of us aren’t ?

 

I look around me here at the top of the south and am surrounded by beekeepers who have been around for 40-50 years and ALL of them are having trouble surviving.

All of them have unsold honey in the shed and no interest.

 

The next squeeze will be on pollination with heaps of beekeepers chasing cashflow the prices will go down.

 

The beekeeping industry is bigger than just Manuka honey producers and I would suggest a majority of them are finding it tough.

Think it's the full integrated ones selling M. Overseas.

And the buyers getting cheap stock and making nice margins 

 

Maybe this forum is for moaners? 

Seems like we all are and Dennis Karin saying it's going well but keep up! Getting unused Manuka country is rare, most likely squeeze in or bump someone off.

I prefer the reality. It depends on who's reality though.

If I was selling good M and making good money I probably wouldn't share that on here. 

 

 

[john berry 5,636]

If Apinz had been more upfront about problems like overstocking when it first started happening many years ago we might not be in quite such a bad situation as we are now and the same goes for things like manuka adulteration.

It's a shame the innocent have to suffer along with the guilty.

Being honest and upfront might also have saved a lot of banks and investors quite a few million dollars.

I like most of the people of Apinz  but their continued rarara life is wonderful, save the bees, plenty of room at the inn has been unhelpful.

MPI  have if anything been worse. I think to this day they have no idea that most of New Zealand already had bees and those areas that didn't probably weren't worth having.

 

[jamesc 4,900]

2 hours ago, Maggie James said:

Try some honey for rooting!  By all accounts it's hard to miss

 

(Actually I am talking about plant propagation, instead of hormone powder.  Wonder if it works with manuka plantings, or whatever the next dream floral source will be)

It's a rainy afternoon ..... I  might go to the shed and try some honey rooting .... sounds more fun than washing frames.

[Jamo 534]

It seams that at the moment a third of the countries hives are producing honey that can't be sold at a price that is sustainable. I am afraid that I can't really see this getting better until the industry significantly downsizes. This might mean that many hives are abandoned and left to die and might be happening already. 

Can't really see how this situation can be described as "good shape" and it would be good if it was acknowledged a bit more. 

[ChrisM 1,277]

with all due respect the state of the industry is not the subject of this thread (please go find your own thread).

 

In respect of the TV One news article and the complaint process, they have sent their reply today that the no breach of the standards have been identified so the complaint is rejected and I have 20 days from now if I wish to complain further to the bsa. I would post it all here but it is 8 pages long. I'm happy to email this to anyone who wants it and my email is shown on my profile. 

 

I don't think I will take the matter any further, I do think they really had to stretch themselves in order think up a rebuttal, so I'm pretty sure they have worked hard at this, which is not without cost to them. Having made my point to these expletives I am just going to move on. Everyone else following will no doubt soon get a cut and paste of the same 8 pages soon and if people are going to take this to the next level it would make sense to have a bit of a brainstorm over it. Obviously the expletives read these posts too, but I can't see as that matters, hopefully a few people in this saga will think a bit harder next time.

[john berry 5,636]

Well I have my answer from the broadcasting standards authority and as expected none of my complaints were upheld. 

I am happy to post it here if someone can explain how to post an email.

Not really sure that anyone will want to read it as it's a pretty long winded piece of legalistic butt covering. Suffice to say they think they put together a wonderful balanced and fair news item.

Like Chris I'm not sure I will take this any further although I am tempted to send it to the ombudsman for their opinion.

My email is on the back of the New Zealand beekeeper magazine if anybody wants a copy.

 

[Grant 4,298]

Save as a PDF and upload the document or cut and paste into word and upload as PDF

[Maggie James 899]

19 minutes ago, ChrisM said:

with all due respect the state of the industry is not the subject of this thread (please go find your own thread).

I think the news items, plus the reactions posted here both reflected the state of the industry and the issues and feelings beekeepers are dealing with

[john berry 5,636]

32 minutes ago, Grant said:

Save as a PDF and upload the document or cut and paste into word and upload as PDF

Sorry Grant but telling me to wave a magic wand would make more sense to me . I will try and get one of the kids to do it. Don't get me wrong I love this modern technology but why they can't make it simple is beyond me.

[Grant 4,298]

Get the kids out of bed, you uploaded the shortcut, rather than the file itself 

[Dennis Crowley 1,351]

25 minutes ago, Grant said:

Get the kids out of bed, you uploaded the shortcut, rather than the file itself 

English Grant, English please.

[Maggie James 899]

53 minutes ago, Grant said:

Get the kids out of bed, you uploaded the shortcut, rather than the file itself 

Beekeepers know how to load a truck, many know how to load a gun, a shortcut - well that's something undertaken on the way home, and a file is something you find in the workshop

[john berry 5,636]

Sorry Grant. The attempt was made by my  beautiful wife. She is younger than me but obviously not young enough.

[Maggie James 899]

On 23/08/2020 at 8:20 PM, john berry said:

Apparently it took a month to make that news article so goodness knows how long it will take for them to make a balanced and informed reply.

I wonder if the news item about honey being the best thing for coughs was their way of an early apology.

When I log into the forum, I always check whose on line.  One of those companies has a lurker who never posts, but just watches.  That's what I call a gutless wonder.  They are political people, and political people only back who they think are a winner at a specific point and time.  

 

People like that don't care what distress they cause to others.  The fact that they state that we are an industry who cares, is a heap of bull ####