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1 hour ago, Christi An said:

if the taxpayer is supposed to pay for something, he/she should be asked first.

I would be interested in where this has ever happened in the world and then the finances have stayed within the bounds of what the tax payer gave the OK for.

 

Politicians spend money on what is best for politicians.  Never a thought for the taxpayer (except at election time)

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8 hours ago, Philbee said:

Im thinking one level above PMP 

Its the Minister who needs to be involved here because he has the Money.

Taking into account all the different opinions in this industry, I would be surprised if there is any carpet left in the Minister's hallway!

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51 minutes ago, Maggie James said:

Taking into account all the different opinions in this industry, I would be surprised if there is any carpet left in the Minister's hallway!

Lol
Maybe there should be a portfolio for Apiculture.
After all there is one for racing.

 

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4 minutes ago, Philbee said:

Maybe there should be a portfolio for Apiculture.

LOL - Not silly.  Api contributes millions to GDP in pollination of everything.  Winston is the Minister for racing - that would be interesting!

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14 hours ago, Otto said:

Why would this need to be expensive?

Could surely be done electronically now...

 

I agree - but with any elections or votes then there are requests for independent scrutineers etc and therefore independent companies ($$$) seem the norm. Without them then accusations fly back and forth

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22 minutes ago, Philbee said:

Lol
Maybe there should be a portfolio for Apiculture.
After all there is one for racing.

 

there is an idea, and maybe we get Morgan Freeman to stand as a candidate...

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19 minutes ago, JohnF said:

 

I agree - but with any elections or votes then there are requests for independent scrutineers etc and therefore independent companies ($$$) seem the norm. Without them then accusations fly back and forth

 

Easy enough to keep square if each beekeeper must use Rego number to vote - would be better still if only those with a DECA number to quote could vote - must be easy enough to stop multiple votes that way without outside gouging.

Edited by Sailabee

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2 hours ago, Trevor Gillbanks said:

I would be interested in where this has ever happened in the world and then the finances have stayed within the bounds of what the tax payer gave the OK for.

 

Politicians spend money on what is best for politicians.  Never a thought for the taxpayer (except at election time)

 

plenty of examples where there were ballots regarding big projects in western democracies. Switzerland is a prime example where often policicians failed with stupid ideas because the voters were smart enough to say "no"

 

and I reckon thats how a democracy should work.

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19 minutes ago, Christi An said:

 

plenty of examples where there were ballots regarding big projects in western democracies. Switzerland is a prime example where often policicians failed with stupid ideas because the voters were smart enough to say "no"

 

and I reckon thats how a democracy should work.

Yes I like that - we could do away with government completely and just make all budget decisions via public referendum.

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1 hour ago, ChrisM said:

there is an idea, and maybe we get Morgan Freeman to stand as a candidate...

Do you mean Morgan Freeman the actor?

If so, we definitely can't afford him!

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19 minutes ago, Maggie James said:

Do you mean Morgan Freeman the actor?

If so, we definitely can't afford him!

I think he has come up on the forum a while ago, he is reportedly already a beekeeper, so he will be used to working for nothing   https://www.forbes.com/sites/trevornace/2019/03/20/morgan-freeman-converted-his-124-acre-ranch-into-a-giant-honeybee-sanctuary-to-save-the-bees/#4004b5fcdfa5

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11 hours ago, Maggie James said:

LOL - Not silly.  Api contributes millions to GDP in pollination of everything.  Winston is the Minister for racing - that would be interesting!

Funny you should mention him.

IMO he's a bloke who never realized his full potential, fell a long way short IMHO.

An Apiculture portfolio might be just what he needs to redeem himself and retire having earned his pension.

 

12 hours ago, ChrisM said:

there is an idea, and maybe we get Morgan Freeman to stand as a candidate...

Winston is our Morgan Freeman.

I know for a fact the Alan duff's first pick was for Jake the mus was Whinny.

On 21/01/2020 at 9:36 AM, JohnF said:

 

I think they call that . . .life ! Don't take it too seriously, no-one gets out alive anyway

I know what you mean,

However, imagine spending 30k treating your Hives, then finding that you immediately need to do it again because subsequent to your treatment program the Mites invade again.
30K !

That's the reality that the periphery just done see. 

Its like paying your rent for the year then getting another bill for the same again

Edited by Philbee
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2 hours ago, john berry said:

A copy of the New Zealand beekeeper goes out to every registered beekeeper twice a year so they have everybody's names and surely it wouldn't be that expensive to have an election. The current system is you put your name forward with some references and the successful person is chosen by some sort of independent and I guess paid for organisation. Like I said I have no problem with the current board but the criteria for selection of board members seems to be heavily weighted towards governance rather than actual on the ground AFB experience. Personally and it is only my view I think governance is something you employ a competent person for and the board should be there to direct that person. Beekeepers like myself and Alistair who have had decades of experience dealing with both AFB and more importantly beekeepers with AFB problems could contribute a huge amount of practical advice on just how to make things work.

 

Hang on John, I thought it was the *board* that is there for governance. The AFB practical advice might come more under operational than governance. . . and this is where things get tricky. Rather than governance (seeing that things are done as prescribed) then the risk is leaping into the operational side . . . something I suspect the board has been accused of previously. Dangerous thing to do

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3 hours ago, john berry said:

A copy of the New Zealand beekeeper goes out to every registered beekeeper twice a year so they have everybody's names and surely it wouldn't be that expensive to have an election. The current system is you put your name forward with some references and the successful person is chosen by some sort of independent and I guess paid for organisation. Like I said I have no problem with the current board but the criteria for selection of board members seems to be heavily weighted towards governance rather than actual on the ground AFB experience. Personally and it is only my view I think governance is something you employ a competent person for and the board should be there to direct that person. Beekeepers like myself and Alistair who have had decades of experience dealing with both AFB and more importantly beekeepers with AFB problems could contribute a huge amount of practical advice on just how to make things work.

 

I take it that what you are suggesting is a resource that is available to advise once a specific problem has been identified.

This task is likely the domain of preferred contractors such as xxxx or whoever, and would come to the fore in the more serious cases.

This would be separate from the board for a number of reasons , the obvious being that these guys could be too busy to ever get to a board meeting

 

Another reason why Governance and Operations are separate is because they are different animals and the secret is to have some people in Governance that at least dig the garden in the weekend

 

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10 hours ago, john berry said:

A copy of the New Zealand beekeeper goes out to every registered beekeeper twice a year so they have everybody's names and surely it wouldn't be that expensive to have an election. The current system is you put your name forward with some references and the successful person is chosen by some sort of independent and I guess paid for organisation. Like I said I have no problem with the current board but the criteria for selection of board members seems to be heavily weighted towards governance rather than actual on the ground AFB experience. Personally and it is only my view I think governance is something you employ a competent person for and the board should be there to direct that person. Beekeepers like myself and Alistair who have had decades of experience dealing with both AFB and more importantly beekeepers with AFB problems could contribute a huge amount of practical advice on just how to make things work.

 

7 hours ago, JohnF said:

Hang on John, I thought it was the *board* that is there for governance. The AFB practical advice might come more under operational than governance. . . and this is where things get tricky. Rather than governance (seeing that things are done as prescribed) then the risk is leaping into the operational side . . . something I suspect the board has been accused of previously. Dangerous thing to do

 

I don't think John Berry is stating that he would leap into the operational side.  I am sure that some have the ability to capably switch skills to governance.  I think it is important to have people from grass roots with plenty of experience who are well known and respected in the industry.  There is a huge amount of governance used in running your own business and undertaking volunteer work within the industry.  I agree with all of John's statement and I fail to see what the "Dangerous thing to do" is in his statement.  

 

I certainly wish the two new board members, whose names are yet to be publicly announced, all the best.  I believe the current board, in the last 18 months, has done an excellent job.  

 

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3 hours ago, Maggie James said:

I don't think John Berry is stating that he would leap into the operational side.  I am sure that some have the ability to capably switch skills to governance.  I think it is important to have people from grass roots with plenty of experience who are well known and respected in the industry.  There is a huge amount of governance used in running your own business and undertaking volunteer work within the industry.  I agree with all of John's statement and I fail to see what the "Dangerous thing to do" is in his statement.  

 

Sorry for the misunderstanding - my "dangerous thing to do" is not about John (that I know? :1_grinning: ) . . more the inability of a board to confine themselves to governance and meddle in operational activities

 

3 hours ago, Maggie James said:

 I believe the current board, in the last 18 months, has done an excellent job.  

 

Agreed !

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We all know the expression’ More was said than done’.....

Like Mr Philbee .... we have invested time, energy and money in Bee R&D ....

I am pretty stoked to report that we have pretty much nailed our AFB ......

It does’nt happen overnight with one Detector Dog visit, but it does happen with patient and persistant pressure, with visual inspection, dog screening and quarantines.

As an industry ....We have the tools, the science and the people power to make it happen..... if we are serious and want to make it happen.

As an industry .....we need to grow into a cohesive unit and push for the idea of an Agency that will coordinate the fight and muster the resources available to make it happen.

Monitoring will never fix the problem.

Action will make it happen.

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17 minutes ago, jamesc said:

We all know the expression’ More was said than done’.....

Like Mr Philbee .... we have invested time, energy and money in Bee R&D ....

I am pretty stoked to report that we have pretty much nailed our AFB ......

It does’nt happen overnight with one Detector Dog visit, but it does happen with patient and persistant pressure, with visual inspection, dog screening and quarantines.

As an industry ....We have the tools, the science and the people power to make it happen..... if we are serious and want to make it happen.

As an industry .....we need to grow into a cohesive unit and push for the idea of an Agency that will coordinate the fight and muster the resources available to make it happen.

Monitoring will never fix the problem.

Action will make it happen.

To me it sounds like you have achieved on a small scale what can be achieved nationally . Find a way to sell it and you won’t need to chase honey anymore 

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On a serious note..... an AFB strategy will take several years to get up and running.

The two top dogs are now retired, a nice bitch is tentatively booked in for AI at some stage ..... and meanwhile Renee is concentrating on his fishing.

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9 hours ago, jamesc said:

we need to grow into a cohesive unit and push for the idea of an Agency that will coordinate the fight and muster the resources available to make it happen.

 

???????  The current agency doesn't coordinate. Or doesn't <insert words here> ?

 

1 hour ago, jamesc said:

On a serious note..... an AFB strategy will take several years to get up and running.

 

Have you read the latest levy update James? It might shortcut your thinking:  Page 3: https://afb.org.nz/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/Management-Agency-Response.pdf

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Thsnks for thst. No ,I have’nt read the current update .... but will this evo.

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23 hours ago, jamesc said:

On a serious note..... an AFB strategy will take several years to get up and running.

The two top dogs are now retired, a nice bitch is tentatively booked in for AI at some stage ..... and meanwhile Renee is concentrating on his fishing.

Phew that was close, I thought Renee was a she.

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11 minutes ago, yesbut said:

I thought Renee was a she.

Me too

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13 minutes ago, yesbut said:

Phew that was close, I thought Renee was a she.

He is Dutch if that helps.

 

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