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Trevor Gillbanks

Beekeeping "Levy" Do we need one.

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1 hour ago, JohnF said:

 

Worse Philbee, its becoming other countries telling us "you have a problem, fix it"  (nosemas in bees, AFB in honey, manuka in honey)

 

 

 . . .and to which the country responds "well, what have you done about it to date? Oh, $300 million in exports but zero in industry funding? Back to splintered groups?"

With the answer of "yeah . . .nah"

I guess we could debate the Levy issue for months like we did last time however it appears to me that only a relatively small group of industry participants actually have the means to contribute meaningfully.

The balance of industry participants are not well off at all and by national standards never have been.
 

However, what they have done is managed the nation's Bees through thick and thin, not always perfectly but often without much support from anything like the Army of professionals well qualified to help other primary sectors.
 

So when the "Country" does push back and makes the points you list, then Id wager that the Beekeeper replies to the Country,
"Rightly or Wrongly it is as it is, All the  accusations and blame you can muster wont change a thing, we have done our best and can do no more."

 

One irony is that any Govt that campaigned on saving the Bees would win many voters over. 

 

 

 

Edited by Philbee

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20 hours ago, olbe said:

unfortunately not all "research " has an apparent benefit to all beekeepers, just look at what MPI's research into "Manuka" has done to a lot of beekeepers bottom line.

 

 

Do you mean that beeks who use to sell their  bush honey as manuka, now cant sell their bush as manuka honey, so the research is flawed.

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1 hour ago, Dennis Crowley said:

Do you mean that beeks who use to sell their  bush honey as manuka, now cant sell their bush as manuka honey, so the research is flawed.

No, he's just pointing out an example of an un-anticipated consequence. 

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On 21/10/2019 at 12:48 PM, Philbee said:

Money and lots of it is required.
In my view that expenditure should be classed as infrastructure investment and time will demonstrate this.

IMO view also almost 100% of policy makers would not have a clue what is at stake given that we now have too many Bees
How bad can it be they must say?

 

 

 

Our Bee population / existence  is like a  gas fire.

A  gas fire  burns as long as a gas supply is turned on.

When the gas is turned off, the fire disappears.
Bees are the same, they exist only as long as the Beekeeper puts time and money into them.

Turn that tap off and the Bees all but disappear

There are no wild ones that can take over the job or provide a resivour .

This is why the task of raising research money via the tax payer is so important, the worse the situation with markets and Hive health becomes, the less able the industry is to fund the required work.

Its a downward spiral that appears much further off than it really is.
 

 

We keep the bees, 

and others keep chickens.

A couple of days back I read a story about a group that was disrupting the truck-loads of chickens that were being trucked into a Tegal plant.  The activists essentially wanted "no more chickens to be killed for food". 

If a law was passed that "no more chickens could be killed for food" then it would not be all that long before the chicken population began to dwindle down to low numbers.  Sure there might be the odd bunch running around on a farm or a lifestyle block somewhere, but commercial operations would close, no money in it.

So the net effect of the actions of these bright young things would be to rob millions of yet to be conceived chickens of their 26 days or thereabouts they could have spent in a shed being fed and fattened up.

In any event it doesn't matter because in twenty years we'll be getting the majority of our protein from plants and cultured meat.

And what has this got to do with bees you might ask?

I haven't the slightest idea really.... but I guess with the level of societal/environmental/technological change occurring even the bees could be in for a wild ride.

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17 minutes ago, CraBee said:

In any event it doesn't matter because in twenty years we'll be getting the majority of our protein from plants and cultured meat.

Im not so sure about that.

In order for demand to necessitate that shift, the world population would need to swell some more and indicate some sort of sustainability at that level.

However its likely that a weak link in the chain will give before that point is reached and the population will tumble.

That weak link may be related to humans being unable get along or maybe a catastrophic public health event, or an environmental event.

IMO  

 

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Oh boy don’t get himself started on non-animal protein! 

 

This is our opportunity to promote and sell NZ products for premium prices. As we drive around and see all the trees, planted gullies and restored areas on our farmers and their neighbours land we can’t understand why this is going to be punished. If you look at the established plantings the majority of the farms should be carbon neutral, regardless of the stock they carry. No treeless farms in Gissy!

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Non animal protein is the building block for extra terrestrial travel .

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There was a report on this issue released a few weeks back.  I think it was overly optimistic about the timing but it may be worth a read.

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/585c3439be65942f022bbf9b/t/5d7fe0e83d119516bfc0017e/1568661791363/RethinkX+Food+and+Agriculture+Report.pdf

Perhaps don't forget that twenty years ago the www barely existed, today some of the world's largest companies eg Amazon, Facebook, Google wouldn't exist without it.

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16 minutes ago, Bron said:

Oh boy don’t get himself started on non-animal protein! 

 

This is our opportunity to promote and sell NZ products for premium prices. As we drive around and see all the trees, planted gullies and restored areas on our farmers and their neighbours land we can’t understand why this is going to be punished. If you look at the established plantings the majority of the farms should be carbon neutral, regardless of the stock they carry. No treeless farms in Gissy!

The tide is turning @Bron.

NZ is more than likely carbon positive and it won’t take long for the general public and in fact the world to take notice . 
Your observations are quite correct . We live in the best place in earth .

As for plant based proteins , they have their place . No one is really seriously concerned about any reduction in consumption of animal proteins any time soon.

And to add , the younger generation may in fact do the world a favour . They are that concerned with the well being if the planet , they will probably realise over population is the problem and set about doing something about managing future  numbers more sustainably . 

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14 minutes ago, M4tt said:

The tide is turning @Bron.

NZ is more than likely carbon positive and it won’t take long for the general public and in fact the world to take notice . 
Your observations are quite correct . We live in the best place in earth .

As for plant based proteins , they have their place . No one is really seriously concerned about any reduction in consumption of animal proteins any time soon.

And to add , the younger generation may in fact do the world a favour . They are that concerned with the well being if the planet , they will probably realise over population is the problem and set about doing something about managing future  numbers more sustainably . 

More rubber waste😜🤣

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My very clever niece has this to say about plant based proteins and milk based proteins. Scary stuff I knew nothing about. 

 

https://tinyurl.com/tednz

 

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I would imagine that there's plenty of protein in bee larvae, and of course pollen

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9 hours ago, Bron said:

My very clever niece has this to say about plant based proteins and milk based proteins. Scary stuff I knew nothing about. 

 

https://tinyurl.com/tednz

 

Very thought provoking thanks @Bron
 

 

Your neice makes a lot of sense . Particularly with regard to the supply of cheaper / better proteins for ingredients .

 

However , on the other side of the ledger, there is a world with millions of hungry people . They are mostly hungry because they can’t afford to buy it and their country can’t produce it . This has always been the case and we need clever minds to think this through .

We produce good food from land suited to producing it . 

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11 hours ago, Bron said:

My very clever niece has this to say about plant based proteins and milk based proteins. Scary stuff I knew nothing about. 

 

https://tinyurl.com/tednz

 


@Bron a very clever niece indeed 👍🏻

 

@M4tt with respect, plenty of commentators are seriously expecting synthetic proteins to make a hole in our dairy and meat markets in the next decade. Currently we’re not well placed to deal with it.  Per the video which is well worth a watch, there will always be a market for our high -end meat and dairy products, but currently we have a huge focus on low-value bulk export. I heard the other day about guys in Ireland unloading NZ lamb from cold containers - just bulk lamb, nothing to identify it as anything special. We absolutely have to move away from this and with some urgency now.

 

back to honey and related bee products this was one of the major areas that enticed me into the industry in the first place. The potential for medical products and small volume (but high value) extracts for food and “nutraceuticals” is almost endless for honey (and propolis, pollen etc). We need to be sending small amounts of very high value products or indeed as per Brons video, we need to be selling technology and ideas. Again, there will always be someone who likes the idea of spreading honey on their toast from the land of the LOTR or whatever, but we’re fooling ourselves if we think we can sell massive volumes of essentially a commodity product at the high return we all need to retire rich.

 

I’ve  often wondered why the dairy industry hasn’t moved to extracts out of milk (for medical/nutraceutical Uses)

 

what has all this got to with this thread? All of the above doesn’t happen by accident. We’ve got a lot of cool stuff going on in honey and other rural businesses but what we need is smart research, fast research, quality research and research! And how to we pay for that? We need a honey levy and the levy collected needs to be leveraged to collect government (and other agency) funding.

 

I voted for the levy and I think while we may not be dead in the water without it, we’re sure making life hard for ourselves.

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2 hours ago, M4tt said:

Very thought provoking thanks @Bron
 

 

Your neice makes a lot of sense . Particularly with regard to the supply of cheaper / better proteins for ingredients .

 

However , on the other side of the ledger, there is a world with millions of hungry people . They are mostly hungry because they can’t afford to buy it and their country can’t produce it . This has always been the case and we need clever minds to think this through .

We produce good food from land suited to producing it . 

 

Geez this forum is a bit like home, don't get much credit for anything hah hah ha.   C'mon share the love around.  It all started with the chicken story hah haha

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This is all good conversation .

 

I don’t believe it’s doom and gloom for agriculture at all . With constant change , which always has been , comes opportunity , often very good opportunities.

There are some very good technologies emerging . This is good . If plant based proteins can be used as binders in Panadol , cheaper, better , there is nothing wrong with that . 
 

Agriculture has been facing headwinds forever as change continues . There is plenty of exciting stuff happening in agriculture and we have clever people steering our naive government in the right direction , thankfully . 
 

It is still an exciting place to be and animal proteins will be a part of moving forward for a long time yet . 
 

It is good others are thinking and finding better ways . 
 

Now , about the levy . Whose going to collect and administer it , wisely . It’s high time a decision was made , or at least , options were put forward 

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Hands up all those who are going to be in the que to eat fake meat grown in a dish .

I certainly will not be in that que .

I can not imagine in my personal life time not having access to protein that can not run away from me if it had too.

 

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I've got 10 ton of bee pollen if anyone wants some gd protein 

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8 minutes ago, Nuc_man said:

I've got 10 ton of bee pollen if anyone wants some gd protein 

 

If its an import are you sure its pollen...

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That very clever niece is coming to live in Gissy in two weeks! I’m very excited for five reasons...

 

1. She’s an active relaxer, give her an idea and she’s like a dog with a bone, she worries it until there’s a solution. She’s very outa the box. She has mad management skills & the paperwork to go with it.

 

2. She loves coming beeking, and is very bee friendly (so much so, I’m gonna buy her a suit)

 

3. Her partner is awesome & also bee friendly. Gonna get Daley to teach him how to make queenie babies. He also can lift heavy weights, loves helping out.

 

4. Dales on permanent maternity leave,  so stoked, to have options for lifting heavy weights!

 

5. Gmas hard work, and what with the promise of a new great, grand baby & another handy grand baby, I’m a third less Gma already!

 

Win, win!

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8 hours ago, Bron said:

That very clever niece is coming to live in Gissy in two weeks! I’m very excited for five reasons...

 

1. She’s an active relaxer, give her an idea and she’s like a dog with a bone, she worries it until there’s a solution. She’s very outa the box. She has mad management skills & the paperwork to go with it.

 

2. She loves coming beeking, and is very bee friendly (so much so, I’m gonna buy her a suit)

 

3. Her partner is awesome & also bee friendly. Gonna get Daley to teach him how to make queenie babies. He also can lift heavy weights, loves helping out.

 

4. Dales on permanent maternity leave,  so stoked, to have options for lifting heavy weights!

 

5. Gmas hard work, and what with the promise of a new great, grand baby & another handy grand baby, I’m a third less Gma already!

 

Win, win!

@Bron, your niece sounds just like the perfect person to be the CEO of ApiNZ - she has a real grasp of the problem solving processes available, and the science of it all and the skills to implement them, oh that beekeeping would be that lucky!

Enjoy the grandies while they are all shorter than you, because suddenly, they all  tower over you, although last weekend while rehabing from new hip, sixteen year old 6' 5" grandson could scarper down a steep bank and collect a swarm for me - bee suit paid for in one go, and he is able to lift full boxes, bonus!

 

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@Sailabee, whooo, one step at a time... 

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18 hours ago, CraBee said:

 

If its an import are you sure its pollen...

All nz pollen

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3 hours ago, Bron said:

@Sailabee, whooo, one step at a time... 

You’re clever neice is now all over Farmers Weekly 

 

Someone’s going to poach her ......

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On 23/10/2019 at 9:39 PM, Bron said:

My very clever niece has this to say about plant based proteins and milk based proteins. Scary stuff I knew nothing about. 

 

https://tinyurl.com/tednz

 

thank you for posting this. I haven't seen these points distilled and articulated so coherently before.

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