Jump to content
ApiNZ Science & Research

Science'ing it up at conference this year

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Dennis Crowley said:

Jessedog, no I could not check 400 hives in an hour or day, but I do check everyday that i'm in the hives, and have done for years, so I wont be needing the dogs.

 I'm not against the dogs, we should use what ever we can. My posting was about the issue you are having with getting the dogs recognised as an expectable tool with the AFB agency, there seems to be a process/link missing from your work to get them recognised at the level you would like. Just saying heres a paper about dogs and we think they are really good is not enough sometimes and you have to provide as John says appropriate trials  that do come at a cost. I'm not a scientist so not my field of expertise and I'm not on the agency board so not privy to the discussions you have had with them to date, but remember that you all voted for no more money for the AFB Agency so they have to cut their cloth to suit that budget. 

@Dennis Crowleyas it has been mentioned before it's not about the money!

Its about getting the dogs recognized as acceptable tool. Its about having somebody saying :Ok let's do these trials and document it as required. But we do need a lead agency to have access to AFB materials ! Like MPI and / or AFB PMP Management Agency. Neither of them are interested. 

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

AFB dog trials should be designed and managed by a professional research organisation such as a Crown Research Institute or University.

The Management Agency has provided permits to access and keep AFB materials under appropriate conditions for research purposes, and would not hesitate to do so for research into AFB detector dogs.

  • Like 5
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Right now the BoP Beekeeper group consolidates 5 specimens at a time for composite Tutin testing in low risk areas and this reduces costs to members. Similarly we have 3 manual extractors that you can rent for $20 per week. I think we could look at the concept of a dog team to check a number of hives and work out a way to do this effectively. It would need to be organised so as to minimise travel time between apiaries. It is possible that it would not be economic, but it would be a worthwhile exercise just to figure out a rough hive cost spread over members and to see if members would be interested to pay accordingly. But, it doesn't require anything from the 'agency' and if various hives were indicated, it would be entirely up to the individual beekeeper as to what was done about it. We've recently had a proliferation of alerts where before there were almost none so a number of people I've spoken to are a bit concerned. Can anyone recommend who I should contact nearest Tauranga to try to work out what it would take?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 
 
 
3 hours ago, ChrisM said:

 Can anyone recommend who I should contact nearest Tauranga to try to work out what it would take?

Hi Chris, if you would like to send us an email on detectafb@gmail.com with your contact phone number, we are based in Hamilton and have some ideas as to how we will be able to assist you with your idea.  Cheers, Jan & Rob Francis, AFB Detector Dogs Waikato.

21 hours ago, Dennis Crowley said:

One issue with the dog research is that the AFB agency does not/can not spend money without levy payers approval to do so. The beekeepers with the dogs who want the research done and then want to charge us beekeepers $200/hr +travel per hour to use them should just pony up them selves engage perhaps, John and his team and get it done. Then as the self employed entities you claw back the cost.

 

@Dennis Crowley  We run the detector dogs out of Hamilton, and I can assure you that we are not getting wealthy out of the experience.  We both work full-time jobs and are running the dog work mainly at night and weekends.... we are doing this because we are passionate about our dogs and their abilities and because we genuinely want to help beekeepers get AFB under control.  And by the way, we are not beekeepers!! 

20 hours ago, Alastair said:

 

Nobody is going to become a millionaire by charging out their AFB dog at $200 an hour. The investment in the dog is massive, for every hour that could be charged, there are many unpaid hours. As a purely money making venture, I would not even bother attempting this.

You are so right Alistair, thank you.

  • Like 2
  • Agree 1
  • Good Info 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Properly run and recorded and repeatable trials are science whether they are done by scientists or not.A lot of work has also been done by beekeepers under the supervision of scientists. Collaborative work is often better than pure science , pure science also has its place but so does observational science and it should be possible to get this reviewed by scientists.

As I've said before I would be delighted to take part in some double-blind tests and for that matter I would be really interested to look at well-kept records of how effective dogs were especially over several years.

  • Like 2
  • Agree 1
  • Good Info 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rene, AFB detector dogs and Jessedog, I know its not about the money, but you do and should charge so there is the mechanism for you to claw back any costs related to testing, report writing etc that you may have to do to get the dogs excepted. The AFB Agency has just let you know in the above post what you need to do to get done what you are asking for. There would also be others who would like to help as well i'm sure, so just needs someone to organise it and move forward. I can't see the problem in getting this done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like it will be a good AFB session at the conference then. Yes, a talk is planned on the dog detections - as well as a demonstration.

Who is planning to go to conference then?? [JM]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is a link to the documentary by Sarah Height an former Otago university student. The documentary is looking closely into the use of Detector Dogs for the detection of AFB

The documentary was made in 2016 and is still highly relevant to current issue of how to detect AFB and the use the dogs. 

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Rene Gloor said:

Here is a link to the documentary by Sarah Height an former Otago university student. The documentary is looking closely into the use of Detector Dogs for the detection of AFB

The documentary was made in 2016 and is still highly relevant to current issue of how to detect AFB and the use the dogs. 

 

wheres the end of the video?

  • Like 1
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think something musta happened when Rene posted because the film is incomplete ..... but the thing is, perhaps the Conference organising committee could get a copy and hold a film evening ...... popcorn... Moonshine  ....  the short film is possibly of interest as back ground info  into how clever the dogs are  ...... but then maybe the management agency might throw a spanner in the  wheel.

Maybe I'll bring up a version of the "Million Dollar Nose" and we can have an illicit viewing, after midnight at a venue that gets flash notified .... the day before the the conference discussion ....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Dennis Crowley said:

wheres the end of the video?

send me your email address and I will try to send you another link with the full video . Vimeo for some reason won't allow me to put the link up.

https://vimeo.com/190422712

try that. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

It is so great that we have now been invited to join the AFB talk on the morning of Friday 28th at the 2019 Apiculture Conference.   We are looking forward to telling our AFB Detector Dog story and how we can help you in your fight against AFB.  It’s been nearly 10 years since our first AFB Detector Dog was trained and there has been a lot of hard work done by Richelle and Rene.  We feel we have the experience and now would like to take the next step of having our dogs recognised as an acceptable tool, certified and Annually audited.

See you there...we have a NZ AFB Detector Dog Site outside and some Detector Dog Demos happening too. 😍

Edited by Jesseddog
  • Like 2
  • Good Info 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Would be great if it was open to all AFB  levy payers to attend the session.  But it would seem that the AFB talk has a restriction on attendance  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, morporks said:

Would be great if it was open to all AFB  levy payers to attend the session.  But it would seem that the AFB talk has a restriction on attendance  

 

You can always attend the conference and register just for the day. The restriction on attendance is that its part of a conference - all of which have costs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How much is it to attend? As I read it, I have to register and then find out how much I have committed to spending, which more than a tad out of touch with present beekeepers realities.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Sailabee said:

How much is it to attend? As I read it, I have to register and then find out how much I have committed to spending, which more than a tad out of touch with present beekeepers realities.

If you use your imagination........$222 incl gst non member single day. Just emphasizes the gulf between the haves and the have nots. 

  • Like 1
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 minutes ago, yesbut said:

If you use your imagination........$222 incl gst non member single day. Just emphasizes the gulf between the haves and the have nots. 

 

Add accommodation and transport to get there and it’s a holiday in Bali :) 

  • Agree 1
  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, Sailabee said:

How much is it to attend? As I read it, I have to register and then find out how much I have committed to spending, which more than a tad out of touch with present beekeepers realities.

Have a look at this page.  $505 for 3 days as Non Member.

 

http://apicultureconference2019.co.nz/registration/

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not forgetting that beekeepers have already paid a levy, then need to pay again to hear what the AFB board are up to.  And ApiNZ memebers get a discount 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is quite a good point @morporks. I doubt it has occurred to APINZ or AFB how it may appear to non members of APINZ (the vast majority of beeks).

It is once again that relationship issue between APINZ and AFB.org that shows up, I think, in a bad light.

It is only an opinion but the costs of even a one day attendance would appear to fence off the majority of the smaller family operators once again reinforcing the question of who APINZ are there for really.

  • Agree 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, morporks said:

Not forgetting that beekeepers have already paid a levy, then need to pay again to hear what the AFB board are up to.  And ApiNZ memebers get a discount 

Yes and with that levy payment you get 2 mags a year with the AFB update in and you are be getting emails on  issues that need your attention. This is a API conference, ne of the benifits of being a member, but still a very cheap conference with lots of info.

10 minutes ago, Ali said:

That is quite a good point @morporks. I doubt it has occurred to APINZ or AFB how it may appear to non members of APINZ (the vast majority of beeks).

It is once again that relationship issue between APINZ and AFB.org that shows up, I think, in a bad light.

It is only an opinion but the costs of even a one day attendance would appear to fence off the majority of the smaller family operators once again reinforcing the question of who APINZ are there for really.

Beeks always wanting everything for nothing. 

1 hour ago, frazzledfozzle said:

 

Add accommodation and transport to get there and it’s a holiday in Bali :) 

Enjoy your holiday in Bali

1 hour ago, Trevor Gillbanks said:

Have a look at this page.  $505 for 3 days as Non Member.

 

http://apicultureconference2019.co.nz/registration/

There will be membership forms there Trve, so next year you can get a better price.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fortunately, those of us that did the $50 Seminar Day in Auckland run by NZ Beekeeping Inc, (same for members or not, complete with spit roast lunch) are pretty much up to date with the developments in AFB testing and the like - $505 puts it all into perspective.

  • Like 3
  • Agree 2
  • Good Info 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dennis

The AFB board will be using this session to get feed back from the levy payers,  is it appropriate for ApiNZ, who are the managers of the AFB PMP,  for restricted levy payers from giving feed back and hearing what the Board is doing by charge $150 to attend at 1 or 2 hour presentation.  Also this session is not on a main conference day,  the APINZ AGM is on the same day .

 

If you want to get into what the levy gets, its a bit more than what you are suggesting.  And as for the Mags- well best left there

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm pretty happy we aren't paying 10c kg levy on all the unsold honey sitting in our extractors shed right now :)

 

  • Like 2
  • Agree 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, morporks said:

Not forgetting that beekeepers have already paid a levy, then need to pay again to hear what the AFB board are up to.  And ApiNZ memebers get a discount 

 

All conferences have costs. Why not invite @AFB PMP Management Agency team to your next meeting then?

 

2 hours ago, Sailabee said:

Fortunately, those of us  <snip> are pretty much up to date with the developments in AFB testing and the like

 

Hmmm. . . sort of. Maybe. Dogs, discussion, disease, DNA. . . but wait there's more !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...