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(Video link at bottom)

 

I think I might have my first case of AFB. Sad face. But it doesn’t all add up with what we are taught. And having revisited the Agency’s site with all the photos I’m not 100% convinced. So, if you have experience please give me your clinical thoughts.

 

Background: I discovered the hive is queenless today and has laying workers. So, only one small patch of brood in the whole hive. It was requeened in March and was QR on 25/3/19 with a good, consistent brood pattern. One FD brood box only and it is full of food. I have had a number of txt alerts with AFB within 2 km of this site, but the other 4 hives here are thriving (atm…).

 

I am pragmatic about this situation and am fully prepared to burn the hive. I have even been given a spot by the land owner to dig the hole. However, what I am stuck on is the ropiness test (see below).

 

Symptoms check list:

 

Holes in cappings - some

Oily, dark, sunken cappings - ish, not oily or that dark, possibly sunken.

Patchy brood - yes (though Q-less and laying workers?).

Foul smell - no.

Pupal tongue - no.

Scale - no.

Ropiness test - has a white vaguely elastic web, but nothing like any of the photos in the book/online. The ‘rope’ is not smooth. Nor consistent in colour. 

No coffee colour.

The pupae and pre-pupae that look a bit suspect are not an even colour.

 

After my initial panic, I am still unsure. But having done some reading I’m now thinking Half-moon syndrome. It is the ‘ropiness’ / ‘webbing’ that I am stuck on.

 

Also, are the AFB test kits that Ecrotek sell any good?

 

I may have missed some detail so please ask. I’ll take a concrete pill. Thanks Paul

 

Here’s a 4 minute video showing symptoms. Sorry about the length: https://youtu.be/sI7FAOYr6u4

 

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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, CHCHPaul said:

(Video link at bottom)

 

I think I might have my first case of AFB. Sad face. But it doesn’t all add up with what we are taught. And having revisited the Agency’s site with all the photos I’m not 100% convinced. So, if you have experience please give me your clinical thoughts.

 

Background: I discovered the hive is queenless today and has laying workers. So, only one small patch of brood in the whole hive. It was requeened in March and was QR on 25/3/19 with a good, consistent brood pattern. One FD brood box only and it is full of food. I have had a number of txt alerts with AFB within 2 km of this site, but the other 4 hives here are thriving (atm…).

 

I am pragmatic about this situation and am fully prepared to burn the hive. I have even been given a spot by the land owner to dig the hole. However, what I am stuck on is the ropiness test (see below).

 

Symptoms check list:

 

Holes in cappings - some

Oily, dark, sunken cappings - ish, not oily or that dark, possibly sunken.

Patchy brood - yes (though Q-less and laying workers?).

Foul smell - no.

Pupal tongue - no.

Scale - no.

Ropiness test - has a white vaguely elastic web, but nothing like any of the photos in the book/online. The ‘rope’ is not smooth. Nor consistent in colour. 

No coffee colour.

The pupae and pre-pupae that look a bit suspect are not an even colour.

 

After my initial panic, I am still unsure. But having done some reading I’m now thinking Half-moon syndrome. It is the ‘ropiness’ / ‘webbing’ that I am stuck on.

 

Also, are the AFB test kits that Ecrotek sell any good?

 

I may have missed some detail so please ask. I’ll take a concrete pill. Thanks Paul

 

Here’s a 4 minute video showing symptoms. Sorry about the length: https://youtu.be/sI7FAOYr6u4

 

Not afb . It is a stuffed queen . I don’t like the drones in the queen cells amongst other things 

 

Great video 👍👍👍😊😊

Edited by M4tt
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I have looked at the video.

That is Sac Brood/PMS

Usually caused by Varroa problem.

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5 minutes ago, M4tt said:

Not afb . It is a stuffed queen . I don’t like the drones in the queen cells amongst other things 

 

Great video 👍👍👍😊😊

Sorry , edit 

 

drones in worker cells 

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5 minutes ago, M4tt said:

Great video 👍👍👍😊😊

 

Are you sure? I really struggled to keep it pointed at the cell with the match stick 🤪

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Just now, CHCHPaul said:

 

Are you sure? I really struggled to keep it pointed at the cell with the match stick 🤪

Well it’s a whole heap clearer than the trashy blurry thing I produced trying to show shiny bees 

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4 minutes ago, M4tt said:

Well it’s a whole heap clearer than the trashy blurry thing I produced trying to show shiny bees 

 

I spotted the shiny bees, so can't have been that bad. Tho maybe that was photos... hmmm.

 

Also, I didn't bother with putting up the first vid that I shot. Could have been filming a different frame half the time!

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Definitely not AFB. The holes in the top of the brood are very symptomatic of AFB but the colour, texture and roping is not. Well spotted and well done for asking when you're not sure.

Also well done on the very clear video.

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I am with Matt on this one. Failing queen with possible half moon syndrome.

The raised cell cappings are not typical of sacbrood or pms

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30 minutes ago, Trevor Gillbanks said:

I have looked at the video.

That is Sac Brood/PMS

Usually caused by Varroa problem.

nope.

simply failed queen and most likely brood dieing off due to lack of bees. notice the odd drone cell.

wrong color for sacbrood or pms.

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1 hour ago, CHCHPaul said:

 

I spotted the shiny bees, so can't have been that bad. Tho maybe that was photos... hmmm.

 

Also, I didn't bother with putting up the first vid that I shot. Could have been filming a different frame half the time!

I have friend with a apiary  with some  very sick hives with sac brood and failing queens .

I had it in a hive in a damp spot one wet spring .

Requeening and warm  dry weather fixed it .

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I just received another txt alert for AFB within 2km of this site. That’s five since February!

 

This apiary is only 10km from the outskirts of the mid-Canterbury red zone, or “death zone”, to quote @jamesc. So, I’m on edge!!

 

Thank you all for taking the time to review the vid and respond. I really appreciate it. 

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15 hours ago, CHCHPaul said:

I just received another txt alert for AFB within 2km of this site. That’s five since February!

 

This apiary is only 10km from the outskirts of the mid-Canterbury red zone, or “death zone”, to quote @jamesc. So, I’m on edge!!

 

Thank you all for taking the time to review the vid and respond. I really appreciate it. 

If still in doubt buy a AFB test or send bees away for sampling, or as you say...take the pragmatic approach.

FYI I shook out a drone laying hive today. So if your hive only a dud queen you could use the remaining workers to boost another colony.

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The rope , consistency and colour will be undeniable. 

Good on you for posting the question.. wish more people asked instead of thinking they know better.. 

31379FD3-047D-41B0-A277-9962617BC43C.jpeg

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On 2/05/2019 at 9:23 PM, M4tt said:

Well it’s a whole heap clearer than the trashy blurry thing I produced trying to show shiny bees 

I found that Shiny bees is caused from robbing

IMG_20190501_111958-1560x2080.jpg

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@Maru Hoani do they loose their fluff in the fighting .

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I have seen the odd hive with parasitic mite syndrome where some of the lavie looked and roped  exactly like AFB and I have twice seen hives (Out of many hundreds)which I thought were very suspicious but couldn't be certain which turned out to be AFB after testing. I have also rechecked a hive (not mine) that was labelled as AFB by an AP2 , it had very bad PMS but did not have AFB. I did however persuade the owner to  give the hive up for adoption as he was no longer capable of caring for it properly. AFB is normally pretty self-evident but not every hive with it has perforated cappings and I have seen hives with  healthy brood and just the odd completely dried out infected cells which were too dry to rope. I have used the test kits  a couple of times just to see if they worked and they did.

I do inspect hives when asked to but  because of time constraints I often ask people to just bring a frame of fresh brood from the suspect hive for me to have a quick look at and I find this works very well. I am happy to do this for any local beekeepers.

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Agreed John. The AFB  hive I came across the other day   looked like a normal hive, but the brood pattern just did'nt look right. Little bit patchy, not very vigorous for a young queen .  On further inspection, scraping the brood capping open .... and hey presto ..... we had a burner. 

At least we found it Trev !

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On 2/05/2019 at 9:00 PM, CHCHPaul said:

Also, are the AFB test kits that Ecrotek sell any good?

 

Hi CHCHPaul,

Yes I believe the kits to be very useful. I always carry one with the rest of my gear just in case. I have only twice had to use them but for the price it is well worth the reassurance. Commonsense and visual observation will always be the most important, but for an extra layer of certainty, you can beat that easy little test. Excellent video!

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I’m going to head to Ecrotek on Monday morning to get a test kit or two. I want to be sure because the hive is basically a box full of winter stores and would be really useful to pop on top of another hive that is full of bees but low on stores. 

 

I like @milkandhoney‘s advice of always having a kit in the truck to confirm one way or the other instantly and save on the angst. 

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12 hours ago, Maru Hoani said:

I found that Shiny bees is caused from robbing

IMG_20190501_111958-1560x2080.jpg

 

see those shiny head ones also have black tail and no stripping. thats CBPV. 

 

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Posted (edited)

I agree Tristan .

 

Type 2 CBPV

 

They are mature to old foragers , ie the powerhouse workforce of the hive . These are the bees this virus affects . 

 

Almost all bees bees I see working dandelions at the moment look the same 

E299714A-02AF-4342-8802-7B443643A124.jpeg

Edited by M4tt
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I wouldn’t call it type 2 CBPV. It causes a number of symptoms that may exisit together or individually. The virus is the same in any case. 

Seems it might be a bad season for it. Other countries are showing increased prevalence of this virus as well

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Not pregnant! At least clear of AFB 😀😊

 

 

Now the box of stores is gone, here is a photo of the ‘left overs’ looking for a new home:

 

 

 

When I took the lid off it scared a big old rabbit out from under the pellet. Frightened the bejesus out of me!

8C5C9544-8D0F-49C0-88B3-33E4E169701F.jpeg

A7F5DA43-1558-40BB-95EB-A9F5E2285813.jpeg

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Glad to hear those kits work. Did my AFB course, went straight out & got one... AFB is a sly dog, I want all the tricks

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