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Frederick

Commodity Levy / Fight for the Industrys future?

RISK OF CLOSURE

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3 minutes ago, yesbut said:

We're a tribal species. Co-operation doesn't come naturally.  What is there in the Apinz reaction that SNI is disappointed about ?

The fact that ApiNZ believes that it was just a financial vote of NO.  Rather than a No vote of confidence in ApiNZ.

 

23 minutes ago, Trevor Gillbanks said:

 

As @tommy dave has said.  It was not a vote on financials, but on the perceived trust of ApiNZ.

It is time ApiNZ had a searching look in the mirror and ask themselves where Beekeepers want the industry to go.  The vote certainly says who they do not want to follow.

 

 

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That's not an assumption I'd bet my house on. If the proposed levy had been a percentage of sold crop the stats would probably be different.

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5 minutes ago, yesbut said:

That's not an assumption I'd bet my house on. If the proposed levy had been a percentage of sold crop the stats would probably be different.

Possibly, but we have also discussed it with hundreds of beekeepers.

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33 minutes ago, yesbut said:

That's not an assumption I'd bet my house on. If the proposed levy had been a percentage of sold crop the stats would probably be different.

Quite possibly , but it wasn’t , which was part of the many issues that need sorting out 

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43 minutes ago, tommy dave said:

the lie that the result was about affordability.

There's an old saying that money cant buy happiness and I suspect there a small amount of truth in this.

But just a small amount.

However there are two events where money can have a monumental effect of ones well being

That is when ones financial situation changes in one direction or the other from a status Quo.

The prospect of moving up from average to wealthy is usually tremendously exciting 

The prospect of moving from comfortable to uncertainty and extreme financial hardship is usually very frightening and can dramatically influence decision making


We are currently in times of uncertainty that will probably result in extreme hardship for many

So on this basis I feel it is both unreasonable  and unwise to categorically dismiss ApiNZ's claim relating to affordability.

 



 

 

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Interesting turn of events.

Not one I was expecting that’s for sure.

 

I have to say that it is quite clearly an overwhelming No.

Obviously there were enough beekeepers with a ‘bee in their bonnet’ over this levy and they decided to actually vote.

Kind of reminds me a little of Nationals terrible flag referendum.

 

I must say I don’t believe it can be chalked up to affordability though that’s probably what ApiNZ wishes it were.

I hope they will be smart enough to take a look at their approach and start listening to the beekeepers they are supposedly representing.

I can imagine this debacle has cost them a substantial amount of money.

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Funny thing is what was wrong NBA, the basic structure was already there they funded research and all votes were done by the beekeepers/members, I'm not saying it was perfect but we'd be steps ahead now.

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7 hours ago, tony said:

Funny thing is what was wrong NBA, the basic structure was already there they funded research and all votes were done by the beekeepers/members, I'm not saying it was perfect but we'd be steps ahead now.

Remember at the time there was NBA and FF BIG.  Neither would talk then either.  So nothing much has changed.

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Posted (edited)

I’ve said it lots of times before but for us it still applies.

We were very keen supporters of the NBA and had been members as soon as we became registered beekeepers.

We voted for the merge of the BIG and the NBA and We also said yes to bringing in a commodity levy back when we were asked at the AGM at conference a few years ago.

We never joined the new merged organisation because it had morphed from a beekeeper led beekeeping organisation to an organisation that included corporates, packers, equipment suppliers and landowners. 

Not only were they able to join they also had representation at the top table.

Our NBA branch  Is now called a hub and from what I’ve heard they meet every now and again for coffee or dinner and a catchup but have no input into industry matters. This last statement is entirely based on hearsay so could be wrong.

 

Until Apinz return to being a beekeeping organisation for the benefit of beekeepers We won’t be joining. 

 

For us our No vote was multi faceted. 

I have no faith in our levy money being spent on anything that will be of help to our business.

when i look at what grants have been given to various beekeeping enterprises in the past it makes me very cynical.

Theres been money for VSH , what good has that done ?

theres money for planting Manuka that has benefited the landowner and the beekeeping operation tied up with it which seems to be mostly a corporate or Maori entity.

theres been money given to a North Island beekeeping company to study double queening vs single hives , why they needed a grant to do this is beyond me.

 

There’s a myriad of other grants that have been given to various people and only a handful will be any use to industry as a whole most of them directly benefit the receiver of the grant exclusively.

 

lastly the 10c kg for us and our non Manuka is a lot of money it goes on top of all the other fees and levies we have to pay now.

It seems everyone has their hand out for our hard earned dollar and each year we get to keep less and less.

Edited by frazzledfozzle
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2 hours ago, frazzledfozzle said:

I’ve said it lots of times before but for us it still applies.

We were very keen supporters of the NBA and had been members as soon as we became registered beekeepers.

We voted for the merge of the BIG and the NBA and We also said yes to bringing in a commodity levy back when we were asked at the AGM at conference a few years ago.

We never joined the new merged organisation because it had morphed from a beekeeper led beekeeping organisation to an organisation that included corporates, packers, equipment suppliers and landowners. 

Not only were they able to join they also had representation at the top table.

Our NBA branch  Is now called a hub and from what I’ve heard they meet every now and again for coffee or dinner and a catchup but have no input into industry matters. This last statement is entirely based on hearsay so could be wrong.

 

Until Apinz return to being a beekeeping organisation for the benefit of beekeepers We won’t be joining. 

 

For us our No vote was multi faceted. 

I have no faith in our levy money being spent on anything that will be of help to our business.

when i look at what grants have been given to various beekeeping enterprises in the past it makes me very cynical.

Theres been money for VSH , what good has that done ?

theres money for planting Manuka that has benefited the landowner and the beekeeping operation tied up with it which seems to be mostly a corporate or Maori entity.

theres been money given to a North Island beekeeping company to study double queening vs single hives , why they needed a grant to do this is beyond me.

 

There’s a myriad of other grants that have been given to various people and only a handful will be any use to industry as a whole most of them directly benefit the receiver of the grant exclusively.

 

lastly the 10c kg for us and our non Manuka is a lot of money it goes on top of all the other fees and levies we have to pay now.

It seems everyone has their hand out for our hard earned dollar and each year we get to keep less and less.

Totally agree compliance cost are out of control ..now we enter a time of low payouts we will see hives neglected , no levy will stop this to many inexperienced beekeepers...watch this space we will all pay the price of this manuka boom . Disease will be number one problem!!!

 

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18 hours ago, CraBee said:

Has anyone seen Frederick?

Fredericks been busy wiping the egg off his face ‘not’!

I started this forum because I considered the negative brigade were dominating the debate and delivering an unbalanced picture of both the Levy Vote and APINZ on multiple platforms with a small number of individuals exhibiting deep seated distrust and vitriol towards APINZ

I stand by comments I’ve made through this forum, the main message being:

APINZ with a new ‘post yes vote’ board structure would’ve delivered the desired commercial representation to effectively send ‘APINZ incl the commercial sector’ along a new path predominately exploring and working for the success of the commercial sector.

Effectively I was happy for a commercially dominated APINZ to handle the Levy which in my opinion should be spent 100% on enhancing the commercial viability of the Industry (with paid administration).

I note SNI are now actively promoting themselves to take the lead on a levy; the only difference I can see between my message and SNI’s is I considered the end result was definitively ‘there for the taking with a yes vote’ albeit SNI levy structure/details differ ! Consequently they may well promote months of negotiation and angst ahead to possibly get back to where we’ve been: Maybe!

In August I canvassed/surveyed a reasonable percentage of the commercial sector consisting of 36 mainly family businesses of 220-9000 hives (74000 Hives in total) and I note:

  • 91% were at that stage against the Levy

  • 42% of whom wouldn’t have a bar of it regardless of how it was presented

I quote these figures to show that regardless of which side of the fence you sit on a yes vote for the Levy was virtually unachievable particularly given the history and perception of APINZ. Therefor a 24% ‘Levy’ vote wasn’t that unexpected albeit I do think they have a general support base above this percentage.

I back ‘Professional Commercial Industry Representation’ which I still feel we can achieve through APINZ and should they wish to alter their board structure and operations to placate the concerns of the commercial sector and incorporate input from the various commercial entities I feel they have a future leading the Industry and I’ll definitely re-join!

I was happy to go out to bat for this Vote and while it equated to the Foxton Old-timers 11 taking on the Auzzi Cricket Team I was happy to take the hits (glad I was wearing a box) and hopefully add a bit to the debate.

I closing I’d like to say I hope my initial summary of a NO vote as follows is way off the mark:

 

  • Vote No and see the industry wallow in a self-perpetuating interest group scrapping mess with no particular direction: Leaving the door open to influences from any entity or group that can gain the ear of MPI and/or the minister.

 

Cheers Keith Rodie

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does anyone think that if this levy had been voted on two years ago when the industry was in the money the result would have been different ?

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45 minutes ago, kaihoka said:

does anyone think that if this levy had been voted on two years ago when the industry was in the money the result would have been different ?

Maybe but we will never know. Beekeepers have always had deep pockets and short fingers. 

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NUC_MAN Of course we will see abandoned apiaries. Until we get the definition written into the AFBPMP this will continue to happen even more so with the low prices.

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If it's unregistered, unmarked it doesn't conform.  If it's unabandoned and an AP2 is sent to inspect it, there are many evidential signs.   I did 14 years surveillance work and at the time these were the biggest contracts the South Island.  I was never declined inspection by a commercial beekeeper, and I never had arguments with those whose hives I was inspecting.  It is also amazing if you are in a "abandoned apiary: when you have a camera, as to what will show up on a photo that is not immediately evident on the day in an apiary. 

 

Currently all you have to do, if you see an abandoned apiary is to report the longitude/latitude reference on your mobile phone or google maps on your PC to the PMS operations manager

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20 minutes ago, Margaret Anne said:

If it's unregistered, unmarked it doesn't conform.  If it's unabandoned and an AP2 is sent to inspect it, there are many evidential signs.   I did 14 years surveillance work and at the time these were the biggest contracts the South Island.  I was never declined inspection by a commercial beekeeper, and I never had arguments with those whose hives I was inspecting.  It is also amazing if you are in a "abandoned apiary: when you have a camera, as to what will show up on a photo that is not immediately evident on the day in an apiary. 

 

Currently all you have to do, if you see an abandoned apiary is to report the longitude/latitude reference on your mobile phone or google maps on your PC to the PMS operations manager

How long is it between inspections before an apiary is deemed abandoned ?

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In the event you suspect an abandoned apiary you need to discuss this with the operations afb manager

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On 7/03/2019 at 7:23 AM, Frederick said:

Manuka’s not responsible for the Honeydew, Bush-blend and Pasture-blend price collapse; it has however been responsible for providing those producers considerable additional income over the last few years

 

How come no one can sell any of those other non manuka types now?

If manuka was NOT responsible, then we should be able to find a buyer at $5. 

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48 minutes ago, Gino de Graaf said:

 

How come no one can sell any of those other non manuka types now?

If manuka was NOT responsible, then we should be able to find a buyer at $5. 

$5 even on a good crop nowhere near enough . If this is the future of table honey it'll be firesale for me ..

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56 minutes ago, Nuc_man said:

$5 even on a good crop nowhere near enough

To keep afloat, or to meet expectations ?

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Just now, yesbut said:

To keep afloat, or to meet expectations ?

To keep afloat maybe 20 years ago when wages matched honey price but today survival mode at $5 only way I'll survive will be with a mortgage...no future in that

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2 hours ago, Gino de Graaf said:

 

How come no one can sell any of those other non manuka types now?

If manuka was NOT responsible, then we should be able to find a buyer at $5. 

Must be Manuka eh!

Nah sorry Gino can't rationalise your message!

 

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1 hour ago, Nuc_man said:

$5 even on a good crop nowhere near enough . If this is the future of table honey it'll be firesale for me ..

 

I agree, though not long ago- like 10-15 years- $5 was a good price.  Was actually a lot less. 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Frederick said:

Must be Manuka eh!

Nah sorry Gino can't rationalise your message!

 

Ditto, don't need you to rationalise my message.  We beg to differ, doesn't make one right or wrong. 

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5 minutes ago, Gino de Graaf said:

 

I agree, though not long ago- like 10-15 years- $5 was a good price.  Was actually a lot less. 

 

 

When i started it was 3$ but before varroa and staff and rmp . Fuel 50cents a litre. O hives where $100 each....something to look forward to

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