Dee Lusby's Bees

[Alastair 8,627]

Browsing some old history on Beesource and found this post by a guy who goes by the name of BeeWrangler, talking about a visit he had with Dee Lusby. It really is pretty funny so have decided to re print it here.

 

Quote - 
About 15 years ago, I was commercial beekeeper in Wyoming. I'd just finished a season testing a few small cell hives and was amazed at the results. So, I decided to make a late winter visit to two Tucson beekeepers who started all the small cell stuff.

You can read more about that experience here: http://bwrangler.litarium.com/small-cell/

After a couple of days chit-chat and a quick look into the two dozen hives on their city lot, they took my son and I west to one of their most remove and favorite yards. It was picturesque and filled with hives of their black native Arizona bee.

I thought about the possibility of Africanized bees. But having successively worked the moderately hot hives on their city lot and swallowed the kool aid about their bees not being Africanized or hot. It seemed un-necessary.

After an hour's drive, we approached the outyard. Cows had rubbed on some hives and knocked a shallow supper with attached migratory lid off on 3 of them. In was quite warm, approaching 90 degrees. Few bees were flying.

My son and I got out of the van. And began to casually suit up. The beekeeping husband went to the rear of the van to light a smoker. And his wife sorted through some equipment.

I walked through the yard looking at the opened hives. There were no bees visible in the displaced supers or exposed at the top of the hives. The burr had been bleached white. These hives had been broken apart for awhile.

Thinking nothing of it, I gently set the three hives back together and walked back to the van to retrieve my veil and gloves. No problem. I'd done it hundreds of times as a commercial beekeeper.

In less than a dozen steps, I heard a shriek from my teenage son who had been distracted by some cactus. I wheeled around and saw a black cloud of bees literally pouring from those hives enveloping him. Instantly, is less than 30 seconds, he was stung dozens of times and hundreds of bees were burrowing into his hair and open beesuit.

I rushed him inside the van. Got him in a veil and commenced killing bees inside the suit and veil. In another minute he would be stung hundreds of times from those gentle native Arizona bees.

Meanwhile, outside the van, a deep angry voice chided the wife for entering a beeyard before the smoker was lit. A few moments later a squeaky, high pitched voiced shrieked angrily at the wife. I felt terrible. She was taking it for something I'd done.

In a couple of minutes things were stable insider my son's beesuit. The van was filled with angry bee. But he'd been around bees all his life. So, I opened the door and went to the rear of the van. It was bedlam.

There the husband was attempting to light some prepped burlap using book matches. He had 3 packs. And had used up one pack. As soon as he would strike a match, a half dozen bees would smother it out. So, he lit a third of pack at one time and got some flame to the burlap. But dozens of bees would smother that out. A couple of attempts proved futile.

So, he stuffed the burlap inside the smoker. Lit off a whole book of matches. Tossed it into the smoker and closed the lid.

Expertly working the bellows produced a little smoke. But again dozens of bees went inside the smoker and smothered the flame. No more matches and no smoke.

Now the yard was in an uproar and the husband couldn't yell or communicate across the yard at his wife. She couldn't hear him over the buzz. So he retreated inside the van. But had taken such a beating outside that when he found a few stick matches in his pocket he couldn't light or smoke his pipe until later.

As a commercial beekeeper, I'd been in a few yards like that. But never so intense, so fast. It all happened in less than 5 minutes without anything being open or disturbed. I won't tell you what kind of beating I took while outside the van for those few moments. It was my fault and I should have known better.

A quick look at my son revealed he wasn't doing to well inside the now 100+ degree closed up van and 100s+ stings. He was starting to wheeze, develop a remote rash on one of the few areas of his body not stung. He looked paie. And was feeling nauseated and anxious.

I'd never seen this before. But I knew enough about anaphylatic shock and I got worried. It was time to go. NOW! If medical help was needed it was over an hour away.

Noticing we were all inside the van, the wife returns for a conference with her husband. Through the closed window she insists that no matter what, she hadn't come this far to work a beeyard and not get the work done. The husband wasn't going back out.

And I insisted we leave NOW! Because of our remote location and the condition of my son.

Not to worry. She said that this situation would be good for him as he would develop a bee sting immunity through it. This wasn't my first rodeo concerning stings/immunity and I let her know it.

And it wasn't my son's first rodeo with stings either. But it would prove to be his last with beekeeping and especially the beekeeper fringe. He was impressed with their hospitaliity and sincerity. But when he watched them rationalize what had just happened with what they had espoused over the last couple of days, he concluded they were nuts. Unlike his father, he had better things to do with his life. And he did.

Meanwhile the wife went back to work as I attempted to convince the husband of the seriousness of the situation. If I had a gun, there would have been a hijacking.

After working two or three more hives, she unhappily got inside the van accompanied by hundreds of angry, burrowing, stinging bees which were eventually dispatched as we left.

Once we got the veil and suit off my son. Most of the stingers out. Cooled him down with water and airflow. And got some water and benadryle in him, he stabilized and gradually lost most of the external symptoms. It took him two days to functually recover. But he was still massively swollen from the soles of his feet to the tip of his head. Both eyes swollen shut. And he could barely eat or drink.

So, that's how native bees from Arizona can handle matches, smokers, young men, and even season commercial beekeepers. I'm not sure about Arizona beekeeping women.

Thank heavens they weren't Africanized!

[Beefriendly 1,254]

Good read @Alastair .. enough to put you off beeking if you didn’t know better 

 

[Bighands 1,064]

6 minutes ago, Beefriendly said:

Good read @Alastair .. enough to put you off beeking if you didn’t know better 

 

I visited Dee in 2012 and her bees were not africanised as far as i can tell or I would not be here today.Ok they are hot but no hotter than the AMM hybrids we used to have pr varroa.Dee sent her bees away to Rutner to be identified and it came back Caucasian not Africanised bees.Ok she cannot sell her outfit to any other state as the USDA have classed Arizona an Afrianised Bee State

[Scutellator 52]

One characteristic thing for the Africanized bees is that you can do some casual work and bees wandering around you for hours, but as soon as you get stung, in less than 5 seconds there will be another 5 stings on the same spot. A lot of fun 

 

The quickest test for africanization is that the stinger is active after 24 hours of the death of the bee.

[Goran 1,523]

19 minutes ago, Scutellator said:

One characteristic thing for the Africanized bees is that you can do some casual work and bees wandering around you for hours, but as soon as you get stung, in less than 5 seconds there will be another 5 stings on the same spot. A lot of fun 

 

The quickest test for africanization is that the stinger is active after 24 hours of the death of the bee.

Sheesh, then I have africanized bees.. Once they hit a jackpot, they continue to hit it again and again and..

[cBank 801]

That is really disturbing @Alastair. I’ve been worried at bees where a cloud chase the hive tool, that is friendly in comparison.

[kaihoka 2,975]

6 hours ago, Goran said:

Sheesh, then I have africanized bees.. Once they hit a jackpot, they continue to hit it again and again and..

When ever I get stung I quickly spray air freshner on the sting .

It masks the warning smell that goes with the sting so the rest do not attack .

[Goran 1,523]

1 hour ago, kaihoka said:

When ever I get stung I quickly spray air freshner on the sting .

It masks the warning smell that goes with the sting so the rest do not attack .

At the beginning of my beekeeping I was at the apiary of my mentor ( I think it was first work for me into the real hive, don't take me by every word.. but), I had one gloves which were not giving enough protection.. We were working one hive at the end of a row and that was really colony from hell ( I think mentor purportedly took me to this one). When one strike at the weak spot on a glove about 20 others on my unfortune followed the example.. My hand was as boxing glove.. Nowadays I don't have such reaction to a sting, but still dislike to get stung. It distracts me from my work, instead of thinking what I am doing I would think when will next sting me.. So I get good protection to don't think a second about calm/angry bees just about I have to do with opened hive.. From time to time some of colonies get really nasty ( like a swarm on a veil), they do die in hundreds and I don't care and with first opportunity that queen is history.. No matter of general thinking that carnies are all calm.. But there is happening some illegal import of other bee strains which may help such nastiness. Next year will be done gene research of samples taken this season and will be interesting to see how pure our bees are.. They have done morphometric analysis and by that we are " pure"..

Edited November 15, 2018 by Goran

[Alastair 8,627]

That is interesting Goran, please let us know what the study finds.

 

Pure Carniolan are indeed very calm, a beautiful bee to work. But if they have some AMM in the mix, which is also a black bee so hard to detect, they can be super aggressive.

[Goran 1,523]

26 minutes ago, Alastair said:

That is interesting Goran, please let us know what the study finds.

 

Pure Carniolan are indeed very calm, a beautiful bee to work. But if they have some AMM in the mix, which is also a black bee so hard to detect, they can be super aggressive.

 

I think the most of imports are related to A.m. ligustica and as new " fashion" buckfast... To me it is done by illiterate people no matter do they have phD, Dr. or whatever diploma.. Ligustica and buckfast in our conditions is risky for overwintering and I should have tons of sugar in stores to keep them alive. We don't have continuous flows as stationary, in fact I have 2 flows which I can extract ( and third totally lottery - lime/honeydew). So the rest of the season such big colonies would " eat me alive". Our carnies are rational with stores.. We also have a brood break which is God giving gift to combat varroa ( let's say it last 2-4 months usually) and due to that we don't know what is acarapis woodi..

I don't say that for your conditions are better carnies which honestly I don't know ( I would have to spend few seasons at your place to get the picture), just I am saying not for my place..

With uncontrolled imports we will bring unknown into our " routine"..

Edited November 15, 2018 by Goran

[kaihoka 2,975]

@Goran Carniolans did not work for me .

Italians are ok , I have a winter flow .

I liked the idea of a ruthless queen ripping apart all her competition and swarming reduced.

However that would really never happen because it would interfere to much with the bees natural process of survival through swarming .

[Jay 90]

Cheez I might start putting my bee suit on in my truck from now on

 

Edited November 21, 2018 by Jay

[DavyK 14]

That was a funny story but Dee Lusby had 200 hives when she was 10 years old and is now an old lady. She gives talks to bee clubs in the states and every one hangs of every word she says for good reason.

[frazzledfozzle 7,483]

To me followers of Dee Lusby are similar to anti Vaxers 

[DavyK 14]

Considering Dee Lusby has been a successful commercial beekeeper for over 60 years in a harsh environment and is a successful Author on Beekeeping and Highly respected by many thousands of Beekeepers. Those who do not think she may have something to say that is worth listening too are far worse than "Flat Earthers "

[Alastair 8,627]

.

Commercial bees of Dees 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEp9YqUE7kA

Edited October 3, 2019 by Alastair

[Trevor Gillbanks 6,846]

12 hours ago, Alastair said:

.

Commercial bees of Dees 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEp9YqUE7kA

 

I love her "non africanised" bees.  

Towards the end of the video the bees even killed the camera.  Lovely bees.

 

Yeah Right

[frazzledfozzle 7,483]

2 hours ago, Trevor Gillbanks said:

 

I love her "non africanised" bees.  

Towards the end of the video the bees even killed the camera.  Lovely bees.

 

Yeah Right

 

And her screeching in the background to her followers put the frames in the box ! Put the frames in the box !

The poor guy was that intimidated by her and the bees he didn't kno which way was up  

[Trevor Gillbanks 6,846]

1 hour ago, frazzledfozzle said:

 

And her screeching in the background to her followers put the frames in the box ! Put the frames in the box !

The poor guy was that intimidated by her and the bees he didn't know which way was up  

Yes.  Jolly hilarious (unless you were there and being attacked)

And to be chased 2 kms down the rode.  Beggar that.

[Dennis Crowley 1,351]

On 3/10/2019 at 10:05 PM, DavyK said:

Considering Dee Lusby has been a successful commercial beekeeper for over 60 years in a harsh environment and is a successful Author on Beekeeping and Highly respected by many thousands of Beekeepers. Those who do not think she may have something to say that is worth listening too are far worse than "Flat Earthers "

On the contrary, those who think that Dees bees are the way to beekeep are the flat earthers, 

[Alastair 8,627]

I'll say one thing, her bees are tough. Kill anything, mites included. Also best I can tell (and i have read Dees writings extensively), nowadays her bees get almost no attention other than having honey taken once a year, if there is any. But they survive, and any that do die are re populated by swarms.

 

Her bees also practise thelytoky, the exact breed has never been identified but a number of African strains practise thelytoky.

 

When the honey flows in that area there can be strong flow, it could be that normal European honeybees might also do well there, although I suspect they would likely require more management.

.

Should add, what is normally referred to as africanised bees, are bees of the scutelata strain or part scutelata. But Scutelata do not practise thelytoky so we know that Dees bees are not that or at least not much, they are something else. Because the exact strain has never been officially identified, and does not appear to exist anywhere else in the US, they have got the nickname "Lusbees". 

 

Nobody knows how they got to the US, it is theorised there was an illegal importation at some point, but nobody knows, or if they do, they are not telling. Dee has been banned from selling bees to other areas, govt does not want these bees taking hold. It may also be that they could not survive in different climate and areas of the US.

 

Also, in the US where you can be sued huge bucks for just about anything, owning such bees in an area where there are people would be a high risk.

[Gerrit 215]

A.m. capensis??

[Alastair 8,627]

.

Capensis are not the only African bees to show thelytoky. There was a discussion on Beesource a few years back about just what the "lusbees" might be, and some knowledgeable scientific types weighed in. Capensis was certainly brought up as a likely candidate but another guy felt that capensis are too area and flora specific, they are contained in a narrow area in Africa and died out when a commercial operation using them tried moving them. 

Another breed ended up being the most likely candidate, unfortunately I cannot remember the name but they were from northern Africa, and show similar traits to the Lusbees.

[M4tt 4,941]

Thelytoky

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thelytoky

 

 You learn something every day 

 

I thought males coming from unfertilised eggs was unusual , now females 

Edited October 5, 2019 by M4tt

[john berry 5,636]

I had the Hawke's Bay bee club come for a visit today and we had a look through half a dozen hives with most people including me not bothering with a veil despite the day not being perfect. Don't think you could do that with Lusbees. I also opened up my breeder from Frazz to show everyone what an older Queen look like. She is still laying pretty good but there was a supersedure cell which I decided to leave . It's pretty hard to find the perfect hive but this one comes close to it with beautiful quite bees and then re-queening itself at the end of its useful life span.