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Are you a member of APINZ?

Are you a member of APINZ  

186 members have voted

  1. 1. Are you a member of APINZ



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11 hours ago, jamesc said:

For sure.... but I’d have my lawyer riding shotgun

So you are saying that you would again happily make a deal with a bigger player,  load a big rig, cross the strait, drive back around the cape spreading your bees around.  No matter how it may/could affect others. Or any other location where that gold may lurk. With the lawyer at your side. That is where the 'family/local' beekeeper is quite different to the travelling big rig. Mind sets, resources,  will power and the lure of gold (money).  When is enough enough? 

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1 hour ago, Gino de Graaf said:

What on earth?? Talk about cloaks and daggers... 

No cloaks and daggers Gino

So many Beeks are concerned they wont have a voice.
They have a voice via this site, its that simple.

My view on this comes from the way this site has established the Paper Tape Staple in the industry
Its mind blowing and has opened my eyes.

Beeks can hold ApiNZ accountable via this site.
Its the ultimate form of democracy 

 

Edited by Philbee
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6 minutes ago, Philbee said:

My view on this comes from the way this site has established the Paper Tape Staple in the industry

The site didn't do it, you did via the site. Your previous post was weird, in that it made no sense to me- the one about website been powerful. 

Edited by Gino de Graaf

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54 minutes ago, Bushy said:

 

Wow what nerve did I touch with my recent posts.

No seriously you need to explain to me and everyone else exactly what you mean and explain what is being done to damage any particular individual.

I am not sure if this is from you personally or generic knowledge by way of a third party getting in your ear.

 

For the record if you or anyone else considers I am "unjustifiably screwing" a group or an individual, then you really have not been reading my posts.

I have provided my full name so I have never shied from being accountable.

I have repeatedly said I support a research levy being put into an idependant trust, not into either NZ bees or ApiNZ.

I have repeated that IMO the only way forward is to officially establish both NZ Beekeeping and ApiNZ as industry representatives and they both survive on voluntary membership fees.

 

What I will not back down on is one group (ApiNZ) designing a system that clearly does not have wide industry support, just so they can get access to $2-$3 million dollars per annum with, as we now discover, Few if any safe guards for small/medium size  nz Beekeepers.

 

 

Holy cow Bushy, maybe its your nerve thats been hit
somehow you have completely misunderstood my post

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4 minutes ago, Gino de Graaf said:

The site didn't do it, you did via the site. Your previous post was weird, in that it made no sense to me- the one about website been powerful. 

Websites like this enable individuals to be heard when they would otherwise be powerless, small and disenfranchised 

Edited by Philbee

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My point is that we can take this opportunity to benifiet from an industry body without fear that body will somehow covertly undermine our majority interests because we actually have a platform from which to speak from should we need to.
We can openly discuss issues that would historically only have been discussed at meetings and AGMs etc.

There appears to be so much fear and suspicion when there needn't be.
 

Edited by Philbee
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4 minutes ago, Philbee said:

Holy cow Bushy, maybe its your nerve thats been hit
somehow you have completely misunderstood my post

 

Yep it's been a hot day and yes obviously I jumped in front of the bus, but combining your slightly criptic post and a random weird levy related phone call I got today, my conspiracy radar was rammed in the on position.

Sorry I will have a second cold one as punishment.

 

Anyway, now back in the real world, I agree the power of this site is incredible, but we can post all day long, and it will mean stuff all if rules/laws are put in place that just ignore us.

Somehow the link from our comments has to result in beurocratic restraint and less misleading dialog.

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21 minutes ago, Bushy said:

Anyway, now back in the real world, I agree the power of this site is incredible, but we can post all day long, and it will mean stuff all if rules/laws are put in place that just ignore us.

This forum will mean nothing if the levy goes thru.  The beg boys will just ignore anything that is said here.  There will be no holding anyone to account if the levy goes thru.

A hive weighted voice will mean that 10% of beekeepers will have 90% of the say in the industry.

It is a definite NO vote from me.

I do not trust ApiNZ or NZ Beekeeping to satisfy the interests of semi-commercials or the smaller (< 4000 hives) beekeepers.

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The most powerful way to voice ones thoughts, do as the French do. 

Sure we discuss issues/ideas on here, people do that on many website forums. 

And the use of Alias names does nothing to enhance credibility.  Bushy once shared his name, and I have completely forgotten (sorry!) because ones name gets shared in one post back in history- and is forgotten.  

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You guys miss the point 

Its not the job of the website to effect change

The website provides a place to both express opinions and Galvanize  for action.

Part of an agreement is each sides recognition and understanding of the others strengths.

Often an agreement is in effect a set of deterrents that create a balance


 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Gino de Graaf said:

So you are saying that you would again happily make a deal with a bigger player,  load a big rig, cross the strait, drive back around the cape spreading your bees around.  No matter how it may/could affect others. Or any other location where that gold may lurk. With the lawyer at your side. That is where the 'family/local' beekeeper is quite different to the travelling big rig. Mind sets, resources,  will power and the lure of gold (money).  When is enough enough? 

Well yes I would ,   but of course it's not as simple as that. It never is.

 For sure I'd load the rigs and spread my bees around on sites where we had negotiated deals with landowners who were happy to rent their land to us. That is the nature of business ..... willing seller, willing buyer. Though others may choose to disagree, we did not boundary ride or poach sites ..... we had the blessing and enthusiasm of many Kaumatua and impoverished landowners who had been ripped off by other beekeepers and were happy to sign up to a fair deal. 

If you look back through past issues of the Opotiki Times you will find a couple of stories of landowners in tears at the size of their honey cheques we paid them. I think from memory one of them was in the region of 140K.   Enough said. 

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1 hour ago, Gino de Graaf said:

The most powerful way to voice ones thoughts, do as the French do. 

Sure we discuss issues/ideas on here, people do that on many website forums. 

And the use of Alias names does nothing to enhance credibility.  Bushy once shared his name, and I have completely forgotten (sorry!) because ones name gets shared in one post back in history- and is forgotten.  

Guillotine ......

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23 hours ago, Ali said:

So you believe the 'big boys' would rescue the smaller boys/girls??? 

Only if it gave them real advantage otherwise that belongs firmly in some other fantasy world I reckon.

Current rescue type operations include massive over stocking (in some areas) and dump sites robbing local resources.

No thanks mate you can keep the 'rescue' bit.

So when your business has finally been strangled by low honey prices,lack of labour and  high wages for wannabees , a collapsed hive price  and enough beuracratic  red tape  to make you throw your hands in the air and say enough is enough, you gonna tell me you not gonna take the Big Boys offer......  the lump sum payment, payable within the week and  no AFB clause. That is the rescue I'm talking about   .....  what they do with those hives is no longer your  concern. You is a free man, or wo-man ,with no hungry, sprayed out, burnt out or mite laden bees to have sleepless nights about. 

 

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12 minutes ago, jamesc said:

So when your business has finally been strangled by low honey prices,lack of labour and  high wages for wannabees , a collapsed hive price  and enough beuracratic  red tape  to make you throw your hands in the air and say enough is enough, you gonna tell me you not gonna take the Big Boys offer......  the lump sum payment, payable within the week and  no AFB clause. That is the rescue I'm talking about   .....  what they do with those hives is no longer your  concern. You is a free man, or wo-man ,with no hungry, sprayed out, burnt out or mite laden bees to have sleepless nights about. 

 

That's right! I am one who will not take their offer. If it ever came down to that. I sleep well thanks and would not if I took their coin.

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23 hours ago, jamesc said:

I really don’t see the issue here with peoples distrust of the big boys. Just remember that when the smelly stuff hits the fan and you need to sell hives... it will only be the big boys who have the money to come to your rescue.

You should understand the mistrust James.

Come on.

We’ve all seen your tales

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14 hours ago, Bushy said:

 

I got sick of the cricket last night so decided to down load the commodity levy legislation to read in an attempt to make all this discussion better and find a positive way forward, but instead I am now really confused and need clarification.

 

The legislation I was reading was revised in 2016 so there is a chance of a latter amendment.

 

There is no mention of voting on how levy money is spent (weighted or otherwise) in the commodity levy act.

 

Section six is the area where levy money is written and states an  organisations levy proposal must contain:

i) how organisation is to spend the levy.

ii) a means by which the organisation is to consult the persons primarily responsible for paying it, as to how the organisation is to spend it.

 

The Act leaves it up to the organisation to decide how levy payers will be involved in financial decisions, and in the ApiNZ rules attached to our voting papers, all we get to do is "DISCUSS" spending at a AGM or special meeting, not vote.

Come on front up! @Dennis Crowley& @ApiNZ Levy Proposal what is the situation regarding individual levy payers having a vote (or any kind of say) in how the levy monies are spent?

We have been told endlessly that we the proposed victims of this scheme will have a vote on how the money is spent. Is that so? If so when/how on what basis????

This is becoming worse than the how many members does APINZ have saga! 

In the delay one can only imagine the scurrying and seeking of legal advice going on in the back ground.

You want us to trust APINZ??????????????

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8 hours ago, jamesc said:

Guillotine ......

LOL, or just plain pains in public behinds.  Rolling blockade on highways, big protests, burn some cars... gets the attention. 

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8 hours ago, Ali said:

That's right! I am one who will not take their offer. If it ever came down to that. I sleep well thanks and would not if I took their coin.

 

I understand both sides- a bit- I guess we won't truly  know what we would do until an offer is put to you on paper. Any offer, whether it is a land placement offer (promising high activity) or sale of business.  Your moral code could be challenged. 

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Corporates would spend levy money on totally different things than the regular jo blo beekeeper.

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In the last week or so, Auckland based nucs have sold on Trademe for $65, $85, and $102. Most hives listed don't sell and are re-advertised with successively lower start prices. Still there are fools splitting thinking they will outrun the market, most will be too young to realise we are doing the utterly predictable boom/bust as we have over-populated and killed the golden goose.

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4 hours ago, Gino de Graaf said:

LOL, or just plain pains in public behinds.  Rolling blockade on highways, big protests, burn some cars... gets the attention. 

You would get to meet some nice people dressed in black with guns.................?

It doesn't seem to tbe the NZ way does it. Always seems to be more sport to watch........

We are not a very militant lot and tend to have too much faith in our leadership for our own good.

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4 hours ago, Gino de Graaf said:

I understand both sides- a bit- I guess we won't truly  know what we would do until an offer is put to you on paper. Any offer, whether it is a land placement offer (promising high activity) or sale of business.  Your moral code could be challenged. 

Each to their own I think but no I would not take their money, no challenge there.

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