AFB Proposed Levy Increase

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

8 hours ago, cBank said:

sn’t there one month anyway? I say give an extra one month once.

 

Police used to give a ticket for no WOF/Rego, and you could get off this ticket if you showed that you got your WOF/Rego wihin a period of time. 

Not anymore- Too damn bad.  

Just register the site! 

[BeeBob 53]

8 hours ago, Kiwi Bee said:

If the landowner has to go for the permit then they may choose to not let beehives on their property.

If this is a permitted activity, then no permit is required.

[Sailabee 1,102]

8 hours ago, cBank said:

 

The milk bottles aren’t see through anymore?

Were they innovating before the current ceo? Mass producing milk powder is what they do god knows something needs to happen to add a bit more value.

There was no need for the new bottles - once the marketing maggots had the new bottles on the market (at great cost) it was proven by laboratory tests that the new bottles did not in any way improve the life of the milk in them.

For those living in town, go to one of the small farms where they sell direct to the public real pasturied milk with nothing stripped out to turn a buck. You will be staggered at the difference between that milk and what we are being sold in the supermarket.

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

so currently, if you a site is discovered to be not Registered- the beekeeper just needs to register?? No penalty?

Talking with someone else, your DECA could be revoked for failing to comply. 

No big deal I suppose if one could get another DECA holder to sign the forms. 

The system needs an easy method to penalise or 'encourage' compliance- nothing massive but a pain in the ars for beekeeper. If it's not, then I might not register mine- worth the risk....

 

Not sure why the agency is not seeking a proportional funding method with our Gov.  Maybe I need to find the time and read those Regulations/Acts---- 

 

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

5 minutes ago, Sailabee said:

You will be staggered at the difference between that milk and what we are being sold in the supermarket.

 

True, though some might not like that pure taste.  So used to current supply.  Like converting a white bread eater to brown. 

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

I concede that Apiweb needs kicking.  By the way, did the agency seek multiple estimates/quotes for the work? And who's doing the upgrade for 500K?

And that the current systems doesn't work that well. 

And will pay an increase, though for each dollar I spend I would like Gov to contribute as well.  Why not? NAIT and BT get tons of funding. 

 

Also, the target to inspect hives- I believe that AP2 beekeepers weren't asked enough to check hives.  There used to be Disease days and beekeepers worked together to inspect hives.  I haven't heard of one for a while. I asked to become an AP2 a while back and was endorsed by someone at Assure- no response at all. 

More beehives could be inspected under the current system.  Just needed to be organised. 

 

And NO WAY is a hive worth over 1K.  It's just to make the 'effort' to save 41,000 hives from destruction seem worthy. Those 'saved' hives will probably be from a beekeeper who has lots of unchecked AFB anyway.  So much like the Dog Registration.  I paid $80 for our short legged friend- 

[Sailabee 1,102]

12 hours ago, BeeBob said:

I wonder if a different approach is needed.  I had to get council approval for my hives as landowner.  If councils would make beekeeping a permitted activity conditional on hives being registered, this would put the onus on landowners to check on the owners of hives on their land.  Landowners could be prosecuted for non-compliance for having unregisterered hives on their land, but more importantly, this would provide an incentive for them to sight the registration before giving approval to place hives on their property.  For registered beekeepers this would be little to no extra hassle.  It also puts council staff in the position of monitoring compliance (and there are many more council staff than AFB people).  Given the direct and indirect benefits of beehives to the district, this would provide an incentive for council engagement.

If the Auckland Council got involved in beekeeping in any way, it would be the end of beekeeping as it would become the domain of only the very wealthy. For example, I have a friend whose sister lives in urban North Shore who is trying to subdivide the large section they currently live on, both sections will be larger than required in the bylaws, and so far they have spent $180,000, in reports etc required, and they are still spending. 

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

11 minutes ago, Gino de Graaf said:

And NO WAY is a hive worth over 1K. 

 

I can see how a hive could be worth over 1k-  Take the value of the hive and boxes and add possible revenue generated.  Both of these vary between operators. 

[Bees 58]

14 hours ago, Gino de Graaf said:

Three aerial surveys have revealed that 20%, 47% and 48% of apiaries in the locations targeted were unregistered.

 I guess these 3 aerial surveys were over Manuka country?

[Trevor Gillbanks 6,846]

30 minutes ago, Bees said:

 I guess these 3 aerial surveys were over Manuka country?

They were done in Taranaki.  And during the manuka flow.  So yes.

[Daley 4,351]

On 23/07/2018 at 9:00 PM, tommy dave said:

it's a proposal. They're asking for submissions. Make one. Good news is that they're stating the problem clearly, and identifying possible fixes as well as a possible route to funding them.

 

and i really wish everyone would read both the presentation and the proposal in full:

http://www.afb.org.nz/Websites/nzafb/images/APINZ 2018 Conference Presentation 002.pdf

and

http://www.afb.org.nz/Websites/nzafb/images/Levy proposal_final.pdf

That’s incredibly optimistic.

The track record shows they’re not particularly interested in listening to industry members opinions when they’re contrary to their proposals.

Ill bet she’s a done deal.

[Sil29er 284]

4 hours ago, Gino de Graaf said:

I concede that Apiweb needs kicking.  By the way, did the agency seek multiple estimates/quotes for the work? And who's doing the upgrade for 500K?

And that the current systems doesn't work that well. 

And will pay an increase, though for each dollar I spend I would like Gov to contribute as well.  Why not? NAIT and BT get tons of funding. 

 

Also, the target to inspect hives- I believe that AP2 beekeepers weren't asked enough to check hives.  There used to be Disease days and beekeepers worked together to inspect hives.  I haven't heard of one for a while. I asked to become an AP2 a while back and was endorsed by someone at Assure- no response at all. 

More beehives could be inspected under the current system.  Just needed to be organised. 

 

And NO WAY is a hive worth over 1K.  It's just to make the 'effort' to save 41,000 hives from destruction seem worthy. Those 'saved' hives will probably be from a beekeeper who has lots of unchecked AFB anyway.  So much like the Dog Registration.  I paid $80 for our short legged friend- 

If I was the government, I would contribute to the industry but only if an when The Management Agency gets their act together and prosecutes. Otherwise is money down the toilet.

[yesbut 6,230]

5 minutes ago, Sil29er said:

only if an when The Management Agency gets their act together and prosecutes.

I think they've stated somewhere they don't have the money to prosecute...

[CHCHPaul 473]

4 hours ago, Gino de Graaf said:

So much like the Dog Registration.  I paid $80 for our short legged friend- 

 

You should perhaps stop comparing this to dog rego. I agree with a lot of what you are saying about this topic, but I don't see the comparison, or, necessarily agree with the dog stuff (so not clicking the agree button...)

[Sil29er 284]

52 minutes ago, yesbut said:

I think they've stated somewhere they don't have the money to prosecute...

Because they spend it very badly. As the government, I would like all their accounts made public before we even get to the discussion table.

[Sailabee 1,102]

15 minutes ago, Sil29er said:

Because they spend it very badly. As the government, I would like all their accounts made public before we even get to the discussion table.

Right now, I think every minute and dollar is deployed sorting their latest blunder (that we know about) - Myco Plasma Bovis.

[Dave Black 3,520]

Small things: Why would a disease control agency discourage multiple small sites that are more suitable for containing diseases? Isn't charging a disincentive to register all your sites? Why would you promote a permanent form of large ‘dump’ sites? How come, over five years, the fees increase 255% (!) and the annual expenditure 314%? There is already a lack of clarity about how big an ‘apiary’ is (200m diameter, radius or chain) so that better be revisited if it’s to be a chargeable unit of measure. If the additional $2mil spent each year ‘saves’ 4,100 hives  (0.5%approx of the national hive stock) valued at $1200ea, at a cost of $770 each (3,160,000/4,100), is that good value for money?
Big thing: The compromise between acceptable risk and logistical or financial constraints is revealed by the application of an analysis of Acceptable Level Of Risk (ALOR), which should make clear what uncertainties are included in the proposition. Like it or not, there is a level at which AFB becomes an acceptable risk. What is that level, and why is it where it is? Where is the analysis?

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

I saw that you can ask questions to the Agency. 

So I did. As below.  Will let you know the response- if I get one. 

 

Good morning, 

 

A few question regarding the Proposed Levy. 

 

Did the Agency seek a Government contribution to help off set the large increase in the Levy?

 

Who will be upgrading the Apiweb? 

Did the Agency seek other quotes/estimates for this work?  

Will the new system use Google Maps?  (if so, realise Google will increase the cost of this service- it might be cheaper at first but they will reap return)

There needs to be a clear cost to this upgrade- not an expected cost- 

 

Did the Agency consider any other Proposals?

 

If I choose not to register my sites, what are my consequences? Please be clear of the process. I want to know how a non compliant beekeeper will be managed. 

 

 

[Janice 3,991]

5 hours ago, yesbut said:

I think they've stated somewhere they don't have the money to prosecute...

Yes, first they say they don't have the money to do anything, then they point out how many more hives there are - so if hive numbers have  for argument's sake doubled, surely their income has doubled as well?  I wish mine had.
 I don't mind paying a bit more but for one or two hives $90 seems fairly steep.

[tommy dave 1,184]

On 24/07/2018 at 6:10 PM, Otto said:

Been having a read through the Biosecurity Order (American Foulbrood and Apiary Levy). There are maximum amounts for what the levies can be spelled out in the Order but there does not seem to be a clause regarding the making of changes to the Order. 

Does anyone know the legal process for making such substantial changes to the Order? 

via a power under the biosecurity act i think? Right at the start of the Order it states " Pursuant to section 90 of the Biosecurity Act 1993, Her Excellency the Governor-General, acting on the advice and with the consent of the Executive Council, makes the following order. ", probably the same goes for either replacing or amending the Order.

[Philbee 4,675]

23 hours ago, Kiwi Bee said:

If the landowner has to go for the permit then they may choose to not let beehives on their property.

Not likely.
In the event that there is a cost associated with Hive placement the cost will simply be passed on.

That is if he chose to
He may just pay it 

Edited July 25, 2018 by Philbee

[JohnF 727]

One thing that seems to have been missed from the AFB presentation coverage in this thread  - that it was admitted that AFB levels have risen by 15% each year . . . for the last 5 years. 

 

Also the $500K was unexpected (for all !) for apiweb and the plan has been shelved for now. I think clifton said that Apiweb would eventually be part of a much larger traceability database ? Could have that bit wrong

[frazzledfozzle 7,483]

I think it needs to be noted that the increase of 15% each year is only the reported cases and IMHO that is the tip of the iceberg.

It doesn't surprise me, there are so many idiots running around calling themselves beekeepers but haven't got a single clue

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

This is the other Levy to consider. 

 

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/105745231/beekeepers-smarting-over-proposed-tax-on-honey

 

 

[Gino de Graaf 1,030]

When flying in beehives with helicopter.  

They get flown out with a crop on.

Then shifted with crop on to a large 'home' yard- either nearby or half a country away. 

The honey is harvested at the 'home' yard.

What would you write on the paper work, for where the honey is Harvested?