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kaihoka

Cow farmers AFB moment

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Yes, thought it could get worse.  Though, if M.bovis is in fact spread via effluent, then forget about eradication. I guess for other users of farms, eradication is the best- otherwise farmers will run each farm with quarantine in mind. Or move beekeeper off to minimise risk....

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6 minutes ago, M4tt said:

That’s what we were led to believe , however apparently it survives in effluent , and for quite a long time away from sunlight , of which underneath vehicles is a perfect environment. 

I was at a meeting today . MPI is bound by privacy , however farmers are open with each other and Waikato farmers are reasonably aware of where the positive farm is . There will be more positives and the advice is to be supportive of your neighbour . 

Yes it is getting fairly serious and heavy . Farmers are becoming more aware . For example , a digger driver was asked if he had been near the positive farm . Clearly the digger was seen as a risk 

 

I already know of farmers banning vehicles from driving on their farm . 

The problem is if M Bovis travels to your farm , it doesn’t just make a few animals sick like other diseases , it destroys the whole business 

 

Can you insure livestock for this type of incident?  That would at least provide for replacement value.  And presumably there is a business interruption risk type of insurance too?

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8 minutes ago, CraBee said:

 

Can you insure livestock for this type of incident?  That would at least provide for replacement value.  And presumably there is a business interruption risk type of insurance too?

Not that I am aware of .......

 

@yesbut, living with it like every other country seemed like a plausible option until you look into what that means . 

 

The symotoms are horrendous and there is no cure . New born calves will cough themselves to death with pneumonia. They have no immunity. It is spread to them via milk . So feeding them kills them .

The main way to spread it between cows is via milking machines . Every set of cups needs to be disinfected between cows as do the Milkers gloves . 

So it leads to a lot of prohibitive management practices just to ‘live with it ‘ 

Edited by M4tt

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11 minutes ago, M4tt said:

Not that I am aware of .......

 

@yesbut, living with it like every other country seemed like a plausible option until you look into what that means . 

 

The symotoms are horrendous and there is no cure . New born calves will cough themselves to death with pneumonia. They have no immunity. It is spread to them via milk . So feeding them kills them .

The main way to spread it between cows is via milking machines . Every set of cups needs to be disinfected between cows as do the Milkers gloves . 

So it leads to a lot of prohibitive management practices just to ‘live with it ‘ 

Is that how other countries manage it .?

Lots of regulations ?

Do you think they will every find how it got here.

That source will need to be moved to a safe house , then given a new identity 

Edited by kaihoka

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2 minutes ago, kaihoka said:

Is that how other countries manage it .?

Lots of regulations ?

That’s from Dairy Australia , and the coughing calves is info from the USA

Edited by M4tt

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To me, I would have thought eradicating it would have to be a whole lot easier than dealing with a disease of bees. 

 

Dairy and other cattle are captive animals whose movement is controlled by humans. With full cooperation from every farmer, I do not see why eradication is not doable.

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Sounds as if farmers living with M Bovis will be the same as beekeepers living with MPI and all there prohibitive management practices

 

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I had a chat to a beef farmer yesterday . He's due to take some dairy grazing on , but is understandably nervous with regards to the risks involved . Farmers are already discussing how to deal with people who visit farm to farm . Ie vets , fert reps ,  farm dairy inspectors , effluent pond cleaners , stock  agents etc etc . I would like to think there is some accurate info out there as to what is and isn't likely to spread the disease . It's not like it's anything new on a global scale , so before things get too feral , I hope the powers that be come out and  put a "best practice" plan in place that everyone can follow . 

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10 hours ago, Alastair said:

To me, I would have thought eradicating it would have to be a whole lot easier than dealing with a disease of bees. 

 

Dairy and other cattle are captive animals whose movement is controlled by humans. With full cooperation from every farmer, I do not see why eradication is not doable.

The industry relies on movement, stop that and the brakes go on , which for most farms would be the end of the business 

All replacement animals would need to be bred on farm which removes land from production

Edited by Philbee
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13 minutes ago, Philbee said:

The industry relies on movement, stop that and the brakes go on , which for most farms would be the end of the business 

All replacement animals would need to be bred on farm which removes land from production

No different to the Movement controls placed on the beekeepers in the early stages of the varroa incursion.I could see this happening as there is no movement information or should I say documentation.

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18 minutes ago, Philbee said:

The industry relies on movement, stop that and the brakes go on , which for most farms would be the end of the business 

All replacement animals would need to be bred on farm which removes land from production

The industry has over time adopted a method of farming that was always going to result in the spread of new incursions. Bovine TB has greatly reduced where farmers follow the law, and Brucellosis has not had a case since the early 1990's. Like those with unregistered hives, it's the farmers who have not fulfilled their obligations under the NAIT laws that have caused the untraced spread. Unlike bees, cows don't wander far by themselves, they have been trucked. 

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I wonder if mycoplasma is one of the symptoms of overstocking ..... went for a ride with a stock agent the other day . His take was that infected farmers getting paid out 2k for a 1k cow was going to put a lot of pressure on  heifer prices when the time came to rebuild.

Of course the sensible solution is to develop a blood test and test the national herd  , but I guess it all takes time, just the the PCR for AFB.  

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5 minutes ago, jamesc said:

I wonder if mycoplasma is one of the symptoms of overstocking

Sheds are definitely overstocked at milking 

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Well this is all very interesting, just lately we've been doing some very big concrete jobs on dairy farms all to do with compliance eg: effluent storage and containment. On farms with large herds of cows these effluent storage tanks have been using up to 150 m3 of concrete just in the floors = 30 truck loads.

We can visit three or four farms a day all around the Waikato and we've recently been as far as Turangi, there are no restrictions on our movements and with the wet weather we've been up to our axles in the green stuff spreading it everywhere....this may all change, more than likely it's to late .

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I have messaged all the farms where I have hives. Two have responded so far and they are planning to implement access changes/processes to their farms. The last one said “thanks for being proactive contacting them regarding this”.

Very stressful time for all of them and just like @M4tt this will change the way they manage their herd and add another layer of costs to their business.

 

What was it like when PSA was going through Kiwi Fruit orchards, were there vehicle movement controls put in place for beekeepers going in for pollination?

 

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2 hours ago, dansar said:

What was it like when PSA was going through Kiwi Fruit orchards

I wasn't much around at the time.  But the trucks and utes got tanks installed so that the tyres could be disinfected on way in and out.  They hardly got used.  

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In theory , cause there is only one road in and out , golden bay could stay free of the disease.

There is a lot of dairy farms here.

There is also a lot of migrant beeks coming into the area. Esp some new ones that no one seems to want there.

It will be interesting to see if this disease is used as a strategy to keep unwanted beeks out of the bay .

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9 hours ago, kaihoka said:

 

There is also a lot of migrant beeks coming into the area. Esp some new ones that no one seems to want there.

It will be interesting to see if this disease is used as a strategy to keep unwanted beeks out of the bay .

 

Unfortunately it’s the landowners saying yes to the new beekeepers dumping over top of the established guys that is the main cause of the problem, not just in the bay but NZ wide. 

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6 minutes ago, frazzledfozzle said:

 

Unfortunately it’s the landowners saying yes to the new beekeepers dumping over top of the established guys that is the main cause of the problem, not just in the bay but NZ wide. 

Unfortunately, theres been years of the 'save the bees' stuff, really never applicable in NZ that adds to the mix as well. 

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15 minutes ago, frazzledfozzle said:

Unfortunately it’s the landowners saying yes to the new beekeepers dumping over top of the established guys that is the main cause of the problem, not just in the bay but NZ wide.

do you keep every landowner happy around you apiary sites or just the one were your hives sit?

Edited by nab
forgot word

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59 minutes ago, frazzledfozzle said:

 

Unfortunately it’s the landowners saying yes to the new beekeepers dumping over top of the established guys that is the main cause of the problem, not just in the bay but NZ wide. 

I can that changing in the bay .

I can see farmers concern about remaining disease free giving local permanent beeks an edge .

Surely the same Will happen in other parts of NZ.

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4 hours ago, nab said:

do you keep every landowner happy around you apiary sites or just the one were your hives sit?

 

No why would we ? 

Does any other industry give handouts to everyone surrounding them?

if we had to give to everyone around there would be nothing left for us.

when you produce non Manuka honey the money available is not in the same league as Manuka you can only make $7 -$10kg go so far and that’s not into the pockets of surrounding landowners.

I think there will be a major rethink in the amount of money paid by beekeepers to landowners now the market has taken a dive. I can’t see how beekeepers in the current could keep paying the crazy prices they have been paying for non Manuka sites, particularly if they have no sites at all that are Manuka to help prop up the non Manuka side of things.

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3 hours ago, kaihoka said:

I can that changing in the bay .

I can see farmers concern about remaining disease free giving local permanent beeks an edge .

Surely the same Will happen in other parts of NZ.

 

I hope that’s true @kaihoka 

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24 minutes ago, frazzledfozzle said:

I think there will be a major rethink in the amount of money paid by beekeepers to landowners now the market has taken a dive. I can’t see how beekeepers in the current could keep paying the crazy prices they have been paying for non Manuka sites, particularly if they have no sites at all that are Manuka to help prop up the non Manuka side of things.

 

The feeling I have got talking to some landowners, and beekeepers, around my area, is that there has been no reduction in agreed payments, or landowner expectations.

 

What has happened instead, is that some beekeepers have been unable to meet the payments and have pulled their hives out and vanished. And yes, there has been a number of abandoned "semi commercial" apiaries.

Edited by Alastair

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17 minutes ago, Alastair said:

 

The feeling I have got talking to some landowners, and beekeepers, around my area, is that there has been no reduction in agreed payments, or landowner expectations.

 

What has happened instead, is that some beekeepers have been unable to meet the payments and have pulled their hives out and vanished. And yes, there has been a number of abandoned "semi commercial" apiaries.

When you say apiaries do you mean sites or bees?

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