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20 hours ago, Scutellator said:

The local mongrel mix in Europe has Caucasian, one or two (out of 60+) lines of Carnica, few strains of Ligustica, Cypria, Carpathica, Anatoliaca, Armenian, Primorsky, Sahariensis, Monticola/Elgon + some relic genetics of native bees in it. And you dare claiming good genetic diversity for the NZ bees, holding only three sub-species of bees as a proof? WoW

You could probably use the same example with regard Humans in Europe and NZ

Europe has huge diversity of Human Culture and Genetic diversity, far more than NZ, but it would be unrealistic to suggest that NZ lacks Genetic Diversity 

It would probably be reasonable to propose that NZ has sufficient diversity of both Bees and People

 

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Could you make a stable hybrid? Yes but why would you want to. Before carniolan's we had a relatively stable line of bees with selection mostly based on production and temperament. Wasp tolerance and

Ah good .... so as a gypsy beekeeper I am  very important to the survival of the species..... bees that is 

Ive settled on a great system of tracking the Queens breeding I use those adhesive white dots about 20mm diameter. Each cell bar is recorded to a donor queen in a diary. When that cell

22 hours ago, Philbee said:

You could probably use the same example with regard Humans in Europe and NZ

Europe has huge diversity of Human Culture and Genetic diversity, far more than NZ, but it would be unrealistic to suggest that NZ lacks Genetic Diversity 

It would probably be reasonable to propose that NZ has sufficient diversity of both Bees and People

 

What .... even in Waimate ?

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20 hours ago, john berry said:

Could you make a stable hybrid? Yes but why would you want to.

great post as usual, @john berry.

if we could turn back time i surely would plea for not importing carnis, but rather improve what was here

or if import, check first how compatible that is with what's here.

but now we have to deal with the situation how it is.

in my view we have on one hand carnis, who seem to deteriorating from lack of gens.

on the other hand italians, who seem to loose quality from hybridization.

the hope i would see in a stable hybrid is, that it wouldn't be effected as much by "mating over the fence" in the sense that they would breed more true.

and also that some of the qualities of the carnis, especially hygiene, could be carried on into the united nz strain.

again, this is not about what we should have done, but about where do we go from here.

 

 

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On 1/21/2018 at 12:44 PM, yesbut said:

We retire, knowing we've had the best of it, and let the next generation struggle.

HaHa  Tony ..... I tell that to my three boys. When I was growing up I was always told that fuel would be an issue by the year 2020. Well , here we are not far short of that and we is still filling up the F'y and I'm telling my boys to enjoy the MX cos it won't be here forever. And I imagine they will tell their boys the same. Life goes on, just a different angle.

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40 minutes ago, Trevor Gillbanks said:

Oh, how I remember carless days and the no fuel sales on a weekend.  That was around 40 years ago.  Still plenty of fuel and there always will be.  Only politics will shorten the supply.

2 yrs is a long time in Politics these days as well

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