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jamesc

Manuka standards

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I've had a bit more honey tested and I have a couple of thoughts. 

Anything with kanuka in it has high 3phenylactic levels. Interesting because this is one of the markers that differentiates mono/multi minooka. Why mpi would choose this marker when it seems to be a feature of kanuka more than manuka I have no idea but that's how it looks to me. I've got kanuka with little or no npa, decent (easily monofloral manuka) levels of everything except 2MAP and really good (700+) levels of 3 phenylactic.  

 

So it looks to me like honey with 3phenylactic will be easy to find. Anyone with kanuka should have loads of 3phenyl. The marker that looks the most valuable to have is 2map. The other markers are easily found in weak manuka/kanuka which as we all know is not a scarce product. 

 

If I was a honey packer I'd be after good strong kanuka, good strong manuka and then blend it with heaps of weak manuka blend to produce a large quantity of 'monofloral manuka'. 

 

I'd say the standard has done nothing to improve the accuracy of manuka honey labelling. The MPI scientists need to go back to school. 

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Cheers for your view there Merk, gives me something to think about. 

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Is anyone getting test results that have surprised them ?

Honey that has passed that you thought wouldn't or vice versa

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7 hours ago, frazzledfozzle said:

Is anyone getting test results that have surprised them ?

Honey that has passed that you thought wouldn't or vice versa

No rush with testing bro .... we is just stackin the drums up in the shed in a mad rush.

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12 hours ago, frazzledfozzle said:

Is anyone getting test results that have surprised them ?

Honey that has passed that you thought wouldn't or vice versa

i believe my honey should be classed as multi floral , but most makes it to mono

at about 100+ mgo and around 800 dha.

you couldn't do blending with it or dilute it.

i wouldn't rule out that some of it is about 80% floral manuka, but would guess more around %70

10% is still stuck in the frames.

 

i believe the quality of this year's crop is above average.

some years most of my honey could fail. but that's how it should work out.

often didn't feel great about selling the blend stuff as manuka, but if you know that's what the buyer is selling it for anyway.......

 

all in all the new tests might be a slight improvement at great cost.

doesn't seem right that you can dilute any manuka by factor 3 and still end up with manuka like Merk's results, but under mgo standards you probably could have diluted it even more....

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I am puzzled as to how you guys get Manuka honey in your hives .

Despite lots of Manuka here and a decent flowering and good weather there is none in my hives or anyone's else's in the area it seems .

That's because there was lots else flowering at the time .

Does it flower in the north island when there is nothing else flowering .

 

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Just now, kaihoka said:

I am puzzled as to how you guys get Manuka honey in your hives .

Despite lots of Manuka here and a decent flowering and good weather there is none in my hives or anyone's else's in the area it seems .

That's because there was lots else flowering at the time .

Does it flower in the north island when there is nothing else flowering .

 

There is enough land covered by Manuka for hives to be land locked.

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10 minutes ago, dansar said:

There is enough land covered by Manuka for hives to be land locked.

I am thinking how difficult it must have been for beeks when Manuka was rubbish honey.

I wonder if the vegetation mix was different 30 years ago.

Was there less Manuka and more clover pasture . 

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7 hours ago, kaihoka said:

I am thinking how difficult it must have been for beeks when Manuka was rubbish honey.

I wonder if the vegetation mix was different 30 years ago.

Was there less Manuka and more clover pasture . 

Going by the stats 30 years ago there were  a heck of a lot fewer bees. So, if you didn't want manuka you didn't put hives near it.

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, kaihoka said:

I am thinking how difficult it must have been for beeks when Manuka was rubbish honey.

I wonder if the vegetation mix was different 30 years ago.

Was there less Manuka and more clover pasture . 

 

My grandfather said it was always the last thing in, "junk" that was left for the bees.

 

A couple of years ago I gave him a pot of it to apply to a lesion on his shin, last time I looked it was still sitting un-opened in

the pantry.  

 

Old beliefs and habits die hard.

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11 hours ago, kaihoka said:

I am puzzled as to how you guys get Manuka honey in your hives .

Despite lots of Manuka here and a decent flowering and good weather there is none in my hives or anyone's else's in the area it seems .

That's because there was lots else flowering at the time .

Does it flower in the north island when there is nothing else flowering .

 

It's hard work kaihoka ..... we've had yards that you would think are in  on the motherload .... flown in bees ..... and they come out a bush blend ....Grrr.  If there is native in the vacinity one has to be open minded and philosophical as to what you will get.

We were escaping honey today ..... Blue Borage. A box an a half per hive. Alls good, they were'nt flown in.  In the afternoon we did a yard of clover , two and a half boxes. All's still good. They were,nt flown in, no landowner percentage.... and still on a flow.:IMG_0381:

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1 minute ago, jamesc said:

It's hard work kaihoka ..... we've had yards that you would think are in  on the motherload .... flown in bees ..... and they come out a bush blend ....Grrr.  If there is native in the vacinity one has to be open minded and philosophical as to what you will get.

We were escaping honey today ..... Blue Borage. A box an a half per hive. Alls good, they were'nt flown in.  In the afternoon we did a yard of clover , two and a half boxes. All's good. they were,nt flown in, no landowner percentage.... and still on a flow.:IMG_0381:

Borage is lovely honey and clover too.

Don't tell me you are going to chase honey dew and mix it all together.

Talking to commercial beek today who said they have done well on Manuka on the coast from murchison to punakaiki.

He said the big rain killed the rata dead and the bees went straight to Manuka.

That never happened here . The rata came back .:14_relaxed:

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@kaihoka, if we knew the answer, everyone would be doing it! Ops! They are....

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32 minutes ago, kaihoka said:

Borage is lovely honey and clover too.

Don't tell me you are going to chase honey dew and mix it all together.

Talking to commercial beek today who said they have done well on Manuka on the coast from murchison to punakaiki.

He said the big rain killed the rata dead and the bees went straight to Manuka.

That never happened here . The rata came back .:14_relaxed:

No .. we are taking the white honey off and movin bees to the dew for the real nectar.

I gave a pot of Dew to a mate up north ages ago who must have  passed it on to a lady in remission from cancer. She rang today asking for more as she mixed in a hot drink before bed and had never slept so well for quite a while.  So there you have it. honey is medicine, not food !

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58 minutes ago, jamesc said:

No .. we are taking the white honey off and movin bees to the dew for the real nectar.

I gave a pot of Dew to a mate up north ages ago who must have  passed it on to a lady in remission from cancer. She rang today asking for more as she mixed in a hot drink before bed and had never slept so well for quite a while.  So there you have it. honey is medicine, not food !

Well you know the old saying , " if it tastes that bad it must be good for you."

For me honey is only a food. But I accept that other people use it differently .

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On 13/02/2018 at 4:05 PM, yesbut said:

Going by the stats 30 years ago there were  a heck of a lot fewer bees. So, if you didn't want manuka you didn't put hives near it.

 

 

 

This. I used to help my old man with the hives when I was a kid, spent more time catching frogs and eels than helping but oh well... 

Dad used to go for manuka even though the price was half that of clover, because we used to get huge volumes of it! 2+ boxes every single season like clockwork, usually more. Back them the region I work in had a lot of droughts and clover was hit and miss. Manuka was a consistent crop that we could depend on. No other hives were around and also there was a HUGE amount of manuka in our area back then. Forestry companies crushed it all in the early nineties to make space to plant pines. I remember seeing hillsides of manuka getting murdered by a bulldozer + winch + huge steel crusher that are now on their second pine rotation..... 

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@Merk, looking at your “weak as” kanuka the 3pla is over 800 and according to MPI the standard for multi floral Manuka is less than 400 so I don’t think it could labeled as any type of Manuka ? 

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7 hours ago, frazzledfozzle said:

@Merk, looking at your “weak as” kanuka the 3pla is over 800 and according to MPI the standard for multi floral Manuka is less than 400 so I don’t think it could labeled as any type of Manuka ? 

Blend it ?

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2 hours ago, jamesc said:

Blend it ?

 

Yes I think there’s going to be a whole lot more blending than we have ever seen before.

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14 hours ago, frazzledfozzle said:

@Merk, looking at your “weak as” kanuka the 3pla is over 800 and according to MPI the standard for multi floral Manuka is less than 400 so I don’t think it could labeled as any type of Manuka ? 

so far i didn't pay attention to this marker cos it didn't seem to be an issue. but if you are right then the other honeys of @Merk are well over this limit and that's supposed to be top stuff. mine are all over this limit too. can only hope there is a mistake.

 

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@tom sayn it's only the multi floral manuka that has to have 3pla between 20 and 399. Mono has to be over 400. I have no idea why multi can't be over 400 when mono has to be.

You would think that if mono was over 400 to meet the standard then multi would be good at that level. 

But I'm a beekeeper not a scientist 

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On ‎9‎/‎02‎/‎2018 at 8:43 PM, Merk said:

I've had a bit more honey tested and I have a couple of thoughts. 

Anything with kanuka in it has high 3phenylactic levels. Interesting because this is one of the markers that differentiates mono/multi minooka. Why mpi would choose this marker when it seems to be a feature of kanuka more than manuka I have no idea but that's how it looks to me. I've got kanuka with little or no npa, decent (easily monofloral manuka) levels of everything except 2MAP and really good (700+) levels of 3 phenylactic.  

 

So it looks to me like honey with 3phenylactic will be easy to find. Anyone with kanuka should have loads of 3phenyl. The marker that looks the most valuable to have is 2map. The other markers are easily found in weak manuka/kanuka which as we all know is not a scarce product. 

 

If I was a honey packer I'd be after good strong kanuka, good strong manuka and then blend it with heaps of weak manuka blend to produce a large quantity of 'monofloral manuka'. 

 

I'd say the standard has done nothing to improve the accuracy of manuka honey labelling. The MPI scientists need to go back to school. 

What's the DNA on this sample

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On 2/13/2018 at 8:01 AM, kaihoka said:

I am puzzled as to how you guys get Manuka honey in your hives .

Despite lots of Manuka here and a decent flowering and good weather there is none in my hives or anyone's else's in the area it seems .

That's because there was lots else flowering at the time .

Does it flower in the north island when there is nothing else flowering .

 

Yea one year I got 500+ boxes. This year only 270. Last season was a very poor kanuka season but the year before they were 3 high

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