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Oxalic and glycerine

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15 minutes ago, Kiwi Bee said:

 

Not too long ago it was said that sewing them is better because the bees do not like the staples. What are the pros and cons in staples vs sewing? I am looking for a sewing machine in the $50 range specially for this.

Staples are easy

Everyone has a stapler
However its slow, I did 1000 in 3 hours today with a machine

Edited by Philbee
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1 hour ago, Kiwi Bee said:

 

Not too long ago it was said that sewing them is better because the bees do not like the staples. What are the pros and cons in staples vs sewing? I am looking for a sewing machine in the $50 range specially for this.

Try and locate yourself an old industrial straight sewing machine.

An old singer Will do . One in a big flat table that goes fast and doesn't shake .

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22 hours ago, Stoney said:

How do I contact you? Possibly 4000 colonies  worth.. 

There is now an add in the marketplace under Equipment for sale

Ive also facebook messaged JM 

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18 hours ago, kaihoka said:

Try and locate yourself an old industrial straight sewing machine.

An old singer Will do . One in a big flat table that goes fast and doesn't shake .

 

Thank you guys for the info.

First. I do not have room for a big machine that is why I am looking for a portable one.

 

Right now I will be fine with the stapler then.

 

I finished with apivar few weeks ago and I am looking to put OA/GL strips in for the winter. Previous seasons I did fumigations(1x4 weeks and the rainy winter weather always gave me some hard time).

 

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On 5/04/2018 at 4:45 PM, CraBee said:

@Lindaloo26 I was doing the last hive splitting today and got your strips chequered in alongside my cardboard ones on a handful of hives.  It will be interesting to see how they go.

 

 

IMG_1197.jpg

 

@lindaloo26 Today I got back to the hives that I'd put your strips into alongside my cardboard strips.  My cardboard strips are wearing more quickly then your strips - as to be expected as they are less dense and less thick than your strips.  I did a taste test on your strips and my strips and they were very similar, still a tang of oxalic in them, but no where near as bitter as when they first go in. 

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On 2/05/2018 at 11:26 PM, Philbee said:

Staples are easy

Everyone has a stapler
However its slow, I did 1000 in 3 hours today with a machine

 

How many bobbin refills was that?

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2 hours ago, Hellsbelle said:

 

How many bobbin refills was that?

Lol

There is a trick to winging a tight Bobin
3 Bobbins probably, 
I just line them up and slam them in as required.
Its the top side that takes the time.

Ill be going to 600 an hour soon, that is when it gets tricky

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The girls were pulling this out the front door this morning. Obviously working the fabric well, these were inserted as double layer strips hanging in the brood nest. 

Going to do a mite sample today. 

A few dead varroa in there, and a wee beetle which I'm hoping isn't anything significant

20180521_094340-914x121resze9.jpg

20180521_094147_crop_604x429.jpg

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i havent read all 46 pages of the thread so hopefully it hasnt been mentioned before, my trial so far has been using coconut oil instead of the glycerine, very low melting point so no risk of vapourising the oxalic, add a bit of water to oxalic to make a paste and stir into melted oil, then when it cools it gives the semi rigidity of a strip so a bit easier to use then glycerine as it holds its shape, i make a u shape and drop over the frames, put it in over 6 weeks ago and i can still see some crystals on the cloth (supercheap auto shop towel) not a mite in site as yet and laying under it so happy so far,  

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3 hours ago, northernbee said:

i havent read all 46 pages of the thread so hopefully it hasnt been mentioned before, my trial so far has been using coconut oil instead of the glycerine, very low melting point so no risk of vapourising the oxalic, add a bit of water to oxalic to make a paste and stir into melted oil, then when it cools it gives the semi rigidity of a strip so a bit easier to use then glycerine as it holds its shape, i make a u shape and drop over the frames, put it in over 6 weeks ago and i can still see some crystals on the cloth (supercheap auto shop towel) not a mite in site as yet and laying under it so happy so far,  

If you use a Staple type strip you will note that it is the top of the strip that goes over the top bar that gets left alone. (not removed)
Thats precisely where the shop towel is placed.

That was one warning sign to to me and the other was dead hives late last Autumn.

Shop towels are fast to place and that is where their benefits start and finish IMO
 

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@Philbee how did treatment go on the 20 mite hive? I lost nucs to high varroa loads with @Lindaloo26 strips. So i am not sure about ablity to pull back higher lvls.  Assuming of course my prep per strip has be done correctly. 

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44 minutes ago, flash4cash said:

@Philbee how did treatment go on the 20 mite hive? I lost nucs to high varroa loads with @Lindaloo26 strips. So i am not sure about ablity to pull back higher lvls.  Assuming of course my prep per strip has be done correctly. 

20 mite Hive? I haven't had one of those for a while 

Which post does that relate to?
 

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Hi Phill, 

You've shared your  success with gib tape.  I understand you keep your bees within some exclusive countryside.  With that thought in mind, do you have any other beekeepers beehives close to your hives?  If not, then your situation is quite different to many other beekeepers who need to manage mites originating from neighbours. 

I could treat mine, get them to low mite numbers and within a short period of time have large numbers again due to some idit who doesn't treat.  

Can you keep us posted on the results experienced by other beekeeper please.  

 

 

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On 24/05/2018 at 9:21 PM, flash4cash said:

I lost nucs to high varroa loads with @Lindaloo26 strips

Not mine per say- we shared a order of cut cardboard.  As discussed previously, once mite loads get beyond thershold - say 3%- the cardboard impregnated strips did not bring the mite load down enough.  Some did, some stayed the same and other kept climbing.  Not reliable at all.  Will place some again in early spring and see how that goes, as I feel that card could work well when mite load low. 

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1 hour ago, Lindaloo26 said:

Hi Phill, 

You've shared your  success with gib tape.  I understand you keep your bees within some exclusive countryside.  With that thought in mind, do you have any other beekeepers beehives close to your hives?  If not, then your situation is quite different to many other beekeepers who need to manage mites originating from neighbours. 

I could treat mine, get them to low mite numbers and within a short period of time have large numbers again due to some idit who doesn't treat.  

Can you keep us posted on the results experienced by other beekeeper please.  

 

 

Sure
My Queen yard and its 800 hectare support area where my Drone Hives are scattered over is close to another Beek who has sites all around the perimeter.
The actual Queen Breeding site is 400m from one of these sites and the Pics of the 3 splits with their paper tape Staples is about 600m from another.
Interestingly he is using the Pams strips extensively.
The rest of my sites are largely next to my own hives which in itself is interesting because even although I have exclusive country, thats not to say that my Hives are overly separated from other hives, but rather that the Hives that may encroach on each sites forage areas all be long to me.
In short, My hive density is no less than anyone elses. 

Edited by Philbee
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6 minutes ago, Philbee said:

If not, then your situation is quite different to many other beekeepers who need to manage mites originating from neighbours. 

In this case, you need to use Honey safe long term treatments
I cannot see any alternative here other than giving up.
A mid season treatment is a logical step if you are willing and able.
Obviously a Synthetic is not an option as a mid season treatment.

However, if your idiot neighbor who may also be financially cornered might benefit from an effective treatment that costs next to nothing.
I suspect that one of the drivers of Mite re invasion has been the high cost of historic treatments.
It is all very well  to use the analogy that treating properly make economic sense but if the cash flow isnt available then the average Beek is Snookered.   

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Cost of mite treatment (synthetic) is high, though feeding bees syrup does cost many an operator more.  For me, it's about the same. 

One neighbouring beekeeper treated very late.  For me in the future, I will need to treat later also- to match their treatment.   

A short treatment flash, soon after honey is off- then again later in the season.  

We put our spring treatment as late as possible, to cover bees in kiwis -  First part of october is ideal, if mite load is okay.  The later the better. 

Many put spring treatment in quite early, for early flow or just a calendar thing. - which then brings the autumn treatment forward. 

 

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13 minutes ago, Lindaloo26 said:

Cost of mite treatment (synthetic) is high, though feeding bees syrup does cost many an operator more.  For me, it's about the same. 

One neighbouring beekeeper treated very late.  For me in the future, I will need to treat later also- to match their treatment.   

A short treatment flash, soon after honey is off- then again later in the season.  

We put our spring treatment as late as possible, to cover bees in kiwis -  First part of october is ideal, if mite load is okay.  The later the better. 

Many put spring treatment in quite early, for early flow or just a calendar thing. - which then brings the autumn treatment forward. 

 

Probably the worst senerio is a late Autumn treatment
If you are considering a late treatment just to get in sync with the neighbor then I would be talking with the neighbor and trying to formulate a workable solution because there are no winners when treating late.
Late equals Dead.

Im not experienced with Synthetics but wasn't the recommended treatment in the old days , 4 strips per Brood box????
Can someone clarify that?

Its clear that any treatment needs to be in the Brood nest and the Question needs to be asked if just 2 strips can achieve that.
 

Edited by Philbee

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I've noticed an unintended effect of the oa/glyc treatment; the space between my hinged bottom boardand screened floor used to be a waxmoth safe haven. With the tape in the chewed paper is falling through and causing some moisture on the bottom board that must contain the oa as the waxmoth, larvae and webbing have been gone since

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1 minute ago, Philbee said:

4 strips per Brood box????
Can someone clarify that?

Its clear that any treatment needs to be in the Brood nest and the Question needs to be asked if just 2 strips can achieve that.

 

Oh man, this topic has never been fully answered. Discussed plenty.  

"brood box" ????  is that a box with brood in it, and what about 3/4 s?

Some put treatment in both boxes, some put only in brood area.  Logic stays, put with brood.  Though, I know that plenty of mites sit in the second box (no brood)- I sampled both in past and got similar mites - so then logic would suggest both boxes.  

2 strips (well, it depends what you use) can work really well. But is it treating all the bees?? probably not aye. 2 Apistan recommended, or 4 Bayvarol, or 2 Apivar per brood box. 

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3 minutes ago, Rhsgc said:

I've noticed an unintended effect of the oa/glyc treatment; the space between my hinged bottom boardand screened floor used to be a waxmoth safe haven. With the tape in the chewed paper is falling through and causing some moisture on the bottom board that must contain the oa as the waxmoth, larvae and webbing have been gone since

I also find dead wax moth larvae after doing an oxalic dribble.  nails them. 

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24 minutes ago, Lindaloo26 said:

Though, I know that plenty of mites sit in the second box (no brood)- I sampled both in past and got similar mites - so then logic would suggest both boxes.  

This has an easy explanation
The Mites breed and spread outward from the Brood
Both boxes require treatment but if a choice had to be made between one box or the other it would have to be the Brood, which is the source of the Mites.
This wouldn't save the Hive but would probably prolong it's life. 

Edited by Philbee

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On 24/05/2018 at 9:21 PM, flash4cash said:

@Philbee how did treatment go on the 20 mite hive? I lost nucs to high varroa loads with @Lindaloo26 strips. So i am not sure about ablity to pull back higher lvls.  Assuming of course my prep per strip has be done correctly. 

Cardboard strips ? 

Where did you get the info on Cardboard strips?

Where are the trials on Cardboard strips?

How much ingredient went into the cardboard?

How many strips per box?

What sort of Cardboard?

How long did they last?

I remember saying that if someone was going to go down this path and use some other method than the one that Id laid out then dont complain if it didn't work.
From what Ive seen of cardboard strips its obvious that the Bees remove them quickly and there is no standard for the Cardboard unless its Ram board which the Bees still remove in a relatively sort time

I suspect that there has been a general belief that the reason Gib Paper Tape is laid up in a Laminate is so as to increase it's thickness.
This is possibly why it appeared a logically step to jump straight to Cardboard.
The reason a Laminated of Gib Tape is Used is that for one, Bees really struggle to deal with this tape as it is specifically designed to be both absorbent and incredibly strong.
Also, the layered design slows the movement of the OA/GL through it as it needs to jump large air gaps

 


 

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