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Oxalic and glycerine

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Had a look in my kenyan topbar today. Interesting to see where I had been hanging a staple. Clearly the queen wasn't interested in laying beneath the staple so the girls packed it with honey. But they didn't want to draw out the comb properly on the the topbar next to it.

The plastic foundation is one of my starter frames (I trimmed a FD plastic frame to fit my topbar and started it off in a lang).

 

topbar strips.jpg

topbar strips 2.jpg

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@frazzledfozzle are those hives with full bottom boards or mesh floors?

 

I put my staples(35% mix) in 3 weeks ago and I plan to reduce the entrances next weekend - I saw few wasps today. And I have mesh floors only.

In May I plan to put new staples(40% mix) in again.

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On 21/03/2019 at 6:36 PM, M4tt said:

Why is he blocking the bases ?

I got around 100 hives done with staples and have put the winter entrances on, will it be a problem with stainless mesh bottom boards? Or do I need to rush around tomorrow taking them off? 

 

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5 hours ago, Maru Hoani said:

I got around 100 hives done with staples and have put the winter entrances on, will it be a problem with stainless mesh bottom boards? Or do I need to rush around tomorrow taking them off? 

 

 

Im no expert but I would think your setup is just fine .

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Why could there be a problem?

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Maru Hoani said:

I got around 100 hives done with staples and have put the winter entrances on, will it be a problem with stainless mesh bottom boards? Or do I need to rush around tomorrow taking them off? 

 

With mesh floors it should be fine.

The issue arises when the hive has insufficient ventilation  and the weather is hot.

There were some interesting issues raised at the SNI field Day yesterday

One was about Argentine Ants and their spread in NZ

Apparently they are spreading and the Scientific advice is to refrain from placing Hives in areas that are infested .

On the face of it that is an alarming situation for an industry to be in.

 

Second point of interest was one that was put to me on the side from an educated overseas Varroa researcher.
He was concerned that Glycerine was Toxic to Bees and instead advocated for use of OA/ Syrup Dribble.

 

Either we are a long way ahead of him or he is ahead of us 
 

 

Edited by Trevor Gillbanks
Typo. error
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I put staples into a apiary  over the weekend. They had the most varroa I’ve ever seen, in worker and drone brood cells, on bees and running across the frames. 

I put 4 staples in the bottom box and 3 in the top. 

Most hives  have 6-8 frames of sealed brood, which is all going to be sick and drag the hive health down down further. Dwv bees just beginning to emerge from cells but not many or none on the frames. Some hives had shaky bees all over the landing boards and pallets. 

A couple  of hives had 2-3 cups of dead bees piled up out front. 

So, my question is, will staples alone be enough to save these hives ??

Im thinking I may have to give a synthetic treatment in 3 weeks or so. And then staples all winter to give the hive populations a chance to recover. 

All the  hives have plenty of honey and pollen on board. 

Also thinking about requeening with cells incase  queens are now infected with viruses. 

 

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13 minutes ago, nikki watts said:

I put staples into a apiary  over the weekend. They had the most varroa I’ve ever seen, in worker and drone brood cells, on bees and running across the frames. 

I put 4 staples in the bottom box and 3 in the top. 

Most hives  have 6-8 frames of sealed brood, which is all going to be sick and drag the hive health down down further. Dwv bees just beginning to emerge from cells but not many or none on the frames. Some hives had shaky bees all over the landing boards and pallets. 

A couple  of hives had 2-3 cups of dead bees piled up out front. 

So, my question is, will staples alone be enough to save these hives ??

Im thinking I may have to give a synthetic treatment in 3 weeks or so. And then staples all winter to give the hive populations a chance to recover. 

All the  hives have plenty of honey and pollen on board. 

Also thinking about requeening with cells incase  queens are now infected with viruses. 

 

The staples should keep them alive and you will be fine with just the staples.  It may be a good idea to put fresh ones in in a month.

 

I never know if it is just the viruses that continue to affect the hive or whether the Queen has been harmed as well, but a good idea to replace them - but let the staples do some work first.

 

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@nikki watts how late can you requeen and still get a good mating .

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23 minutes ago, nikki watts said:

I put staples into a apiary  over the weekend. They had the most varroa I’ve ever seen, in worker and drone brood cells, on bees and running across the frames. 

I put 4 staples in the bottom box and 3 in the top. 

Most hives  have 6-8 frames of sealed brood, which is all going to be sick and drag the hive health down down further. Dwv bees just beginning to emerge from cells but not many or none on the frames. Some hives had shaky bees all over the landing boards and pallets. 

A couple  of hives had 2-3 cups of dead bees piled up out front. 

So, my question is, will staples alone be enough to save these hives ??

Im thinking I may have to give a synthetic treatment in 3 weeks or so. And then staples all winter to give the hive populations a chance to recover. 

All the  hives have plenty of honey and pollen on board. 

Also thinking about requeening with cells incase  queens are now infected with viruses. 

 

Hi Nikki
I would do some Hives with Synthetics and some with Staples
I would suspect that either way its likely that you will lose some of the Hives as the Brood will be full of Mites and Virus with limited time for the Queen to lay clean Brood for winter (Depends a little on where the Hives are)
Even the Queens might be compromised.

Its a bad situation to be in and I would predict that the survivors will go into winter as marginal small Hives
 

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16 minutes ago, CraBee said:

The staples should keep them alive and you will be fine with just the staples.  It may be a good idea to put fresh ones in in a month.

 

I never know if it is just the viruses that continue to affect the hive or whether the Queen has been harmed as well, but a good idea to replace them - but let the staples do some work first.

 

 

4 minutes ago, Philbee said:

Hi Nikki
I would do some Hives with Synthetics and some with Staples
I would suspect that either way its likely that you will lose some of the Hives as the Brood will be full of Mites and Virus with limited time for the Queen to lay clean Brood for winter (Depends a little on where the Hives are)
Even the Queens might be compromised.

Its a bad situation to be in and I would predict that the survivors will go into winter as marginal small Hives
 

Yes, they will be reduced down the one box for winter. In National Park area so hoping a good cold winter will help break brood and virus reproduction. 

Still plenty of drones in the hive but of course they will be compromised too. 

Its tempting to remove all the capped brood and replace with clean comb. 

Right now just hoping to get queens through the winter with a reasonable cluster. 

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Also Nikki

When were the Hives last treated and what with?

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3 hours ago, Philbee said:

With mesh floors it should be fine.

The issue arises when the hive has insufficient ventilation  and the weather is hot.

There were some interesting issues raised at the SNI field Day yesterday

One was about Argentine Ants and their spread in NZ

Apparently they are spreading and the Scientific advice is to refrain from placing Hives in areas that are infested .

On the face of it that is an alarming situation for an industry to be in. 

 

Second point of interest was one that was put to me on the side from an educated overseas Varroa researcher.
He was concerned that Glycerine was Toxic to Bees and instead advocated for use of OA/ Syrup Dribble.

 

Either we are a long way ahead of him or he is ahead of us 
 

 

I don't have any Argentine Ants in any of my apiaries but I am aware of them being in others and the beekeepers are managing them with ant poison in small containers under the hive lids, they report some success with this and no effect on the bees.

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4 minutes ago, BJC said:

I don't have any Argentine Ants in any of my apiaries but I am aware of them being in others and the beekeepers are managing them with ant poison in small containers under the hive lids, they report some success with this and no effect on the bees.

The presentation I heard indicated that there was indeed some products that were able to safely control these pests but that isnt the end of it
There is a big potentially a huge difference between controlling at an apiary level and halting the spread at a national level.
 

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Just now, Philbee said:

The presentation I heard indicated that there was indeed some products that were able to safely control these pests but that isnt the end of it
There is a big potentially a huge difference between controlling at an apiary level and halting the spread at a national level.
 

I agree and it is a major concern of how rapidly they are spreading throughout the country, they are particularly aggressive and very resilient as I understand it.

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On the face of it these ants could threaten the viability of entire regions of sites unless someone can come up with some sort of physical barrier to isolate them from the Hive.
 

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14 minutes ago, Philbee said:

On the face of it these ants could threaten the viability of entire regions of sites unless someone can come up with some sort of physical barrier to isolate them from the Hive.
 

 

Water? Pallet on blocks which sit in a liquid. Probably hard to keep full in summer with stock.

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On 24/03/2019 at 11:43 AM, cBank said:

 

Thanks.

I’m all 3/4 so there is a bit of bias due to self interest.

 

I’ve tried 7 in some 2 box hives and 8 in others. I think I like 8 but that’s only due to symmetry when setting it up. My mite numbers are going down faster than I’d hoped.

My 40% brew was made much more accurately and temperature controlled carefully. The mix was completely clear, but I too have crystallisation on some parts of some staples. Some are very chewed, some not. Some queens lay under them and some won’t cross them to lay.

The only time I had trouble with crystallisation was when I left them in the soaking bucket for a week. Every other time I have taken them out within two or three days to drain... and no crystals. 

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I am hearing through an AP2 friend of mine that there are people that can not afford varroa treatment this autumn so are just going with out.  

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2 minutes ago, flash4cash said:

I am hearing through an AP2 friend of mine that there are people that can not afford varroa treatment this autumn so are just going with out.  

Almost all of those hives will be dead, or so sick when they do treat it will be a hard road back. That's an obvious statement.

 

That will be like back a few  years when there were feral hives being killed off by varroa. Mite bombs potentially collapsing other beeks hives 

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I think the prudent thing to do for the next year or so is just do near continuous treatment 

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5 hours ago, BJC said:

I agree and it is a major concern of how rapidly they are spreading throughout the country, they are particularly aggressive and very resilient as I understand it.

Almost as resilient as the folk who have had these ants for years and steadfastly refused to allow anyone to lay poison on their property to properly deal with them. 

 

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4 hours ago, M4tt said:

Almost all of those hives will be dead, or so sick when they do treat it will be a hard road back. That's an obvious statement.

 

That will be like back a few  years when there were feral hives being killed off by varroa. Mite bombs potentially collapsing other beeks hives 

I tried to get some crowd funding to create a pool of money to address this inevitable event through this winter

A way that the hive numbers could be managed down from now to spring.
I fear we have now run out of time.
50K would have done it and could have enabled APs to deal with issues as required.

If this sounds self serving its not, Im way past getting greedy for 50K worth of sales because 50k worth of sales  represents a lot of hard work

 

6 hours ago, cBank said:

 

Water? Pallet on blocks which sit in a liquid. Probably hard to keep full in summer with stock.

Maybe a seperate thread for this.

However here is an idea I would try.
In the old days I used a salt water solution in polymer water crystals as a conductive gel for heartrate monitor electrodes for horse Heartrate monitors
Instead of moats of plain drinking water Id start by seeing if the ants would cross a salt water moat of crystals which do dehydrate but not as quickly as water.

They are rehydrated by adding water

There may be all sorts of safe stuff that the crystals would hold and yet the stock wouldn't touch and that the ants wouldnt like to cross

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10 hours ago, Philbee said:

One was about Argentine Ants and their spread in NZ

Apparently they are spreading and the Scientific advice is to refrain from placing Hives in areas that are infested .

On the face of it that is an alarming situation for an industry to be in.

 

 

Heard of a few hives being wiped out by them late this summer, including belonging to someone pretty onto it

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